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The Grey NATO – 364 – Guy Allen And How 40+ Years In Watches Brought Him To Elliot Brown

Published on Thu, 12 Feb 2026 06:00:00 -0500

Synopsis

In this episode of The Grey NATO (Episode 364), hosts James Stacy and Jason Heaton welcome Guy Allen, head of sales at Elliott Brown watches, for an extended conversation about his remarkable 45-year career in the watch industry. Guy shares fascinating stories from his beginnings working Saturday mornings at a retail jeweler in the 1970s, through an unexpected detour sourcing emeralds in South America, to his time working with prestigious brands like Zenith during the pivotal late 1980s when the El Primero movement was being supplied to Rolex for the Daytona.

The conversation explores how dramatically the watch industry has transformed over the decades, from winding mechanical watches each morning in retail stores to today's landscape where independent brands have carved out their own category. Guy discusses the evolution from an era when Rolex Daytonas were nearly worthless trade-ins to the current collector market, and how the internet and enthusiast media have fundamentally changed the relationship between brands, retailers, and consumers. He explains Elliott Brown's strategic decision to close all retail partnerships and focus on direct-to-consumer sales and the North American market, the challenges of navigating recent tariff situations, and how the brand maintains its tool-watch DNA while remaining playful and accessible. The episode also touches on both hosts' current watches, Jason's enjoyment of his Elliott Brown Holton GMT, and exciting news about Thomas Holland joining the new Grand Tour cast.

Transcript

Speaker
James Stacy Hello and welcome to another episode of the Grey NATO. It's a loose discussion of travel, adventure, diving, driving gear, and most certainly watches. This is episode 364, and it's proudly brought to you by the always growing TG and supporter crew. We thank you all so much for your continued support. And if you're listening and would like to support the show, please visit thegreenado.com for more details. My name is James Stacy, and I'm joined as ever by my friend and co-host Jason Heaton. Hey Jason,
Jason Heaton how are we doing? I'm doing pretty well. I'm actually um pretty excited about today's episode. I always kind of get a little bit kind of amped up for uh for guest episodes. It's uh it's always fun to have a a third person on, or sometimes a fourth person in some cases. But
James Stacy uh yeah, this one's a good one. It is, yeah. We just just finished recording with Guy. Uh obviously you can't bury a lead on uh on an episode that has gentleman's name in the title. We don't commonly have like people come on to talk about the brand, but man, you get talking to Guy and like I I thought it was A lot of it as like someone who made real decisions and like tried to keep brands from you know, crashing and burning to a certain extent. And you and I have just been, you know, kind of really impressed by the the Elliott Brown product. Uh so when when it looked like uh we had the option of having Guy on, I mean we started talking about this during the Toronto show, so September of last year. Uh when I learned a little bit about his past with Zenith and and all these other brands and retail and distribution and and all that. And uh and then when it looked like it would work out and we needed a a guest for this week for you know for something to uh chat with uh it w it was very nice of guy to be available to hop on a mic. So it was a good chat and one I'm I'm looking forward to getting to in just a few minutes here. I
Jason Heaton mean I I mentioned it when we were clicking off with with Guy but um the time flew more than almost any other episode we've done. I I suddenly looked up at the timer on uh on the recording here and it was like we're you know, pushing forty six, forty seven minutes and I thought, wow, it just it felt like we were just on for twenty five minutes and it was just uh it was a fun chat and we've met Guy and Jem um who does the marketing for uh Elliot Brown at at a couple of shows and and they're great and I remember my first interaction with Jem was fun too. I did a Zoom call with her I think it was during the pandemic and we were just talking about Elliot Brown in general, and it was my first introduction to her, and she was sitting at in her kitchen and she had this wall of uh booze bottles behind her, and and then we got to talking about gin. And she used to work for a company that I don't know if they imported gin or sold gin and she gave me all sorts of pointers about about the best gin and I still ping her for for tips every now and then. So who knows? Maybe we'll have to have gem on sometime and talk talk
James Stacy gin. Yeah, for sure. No, I th I think uh I think you know, guys uh I mean, for lack of a battle ride, just a normal dude. Yeah. Um, easy guy to talk to, lots of perspective on the watch industry, not just uh the brand that he works for, but otherwise. So definitely fun to have him on. You know, beyond that, because we'll get to it in a few minutes. How have you been? Yeah, not not uh nothing to
Jason Heaton o exciting to report here. Just kind of a classic uh Minnesota winter midwinter week. Um we did uh I think I might have talked about this last year, uh Christy and I went, there's a you know, one of the great things about living here is the all the frozen lakes um that I you know we just take for granted, and I'm I'm sure you get them there as well, of course. Um, but for people that just live in other parts of the country or the world. Like the idea of like walking on a frozen body of water is is a very foreign concept. And you know, there's there are so many lakes here and they're all frozen over this time of year. And the one that's closest to me here, um every winter for a couple of weeks they do what they call the art shanty um program or show or whatever where um you know these these kind of ice fishing houses or you know ice houses um very small shacks that that people build um they're they're art installations actually. And so artists actually festoon them and and build them out um with different themes and then they put them out in the middle of the lake and they create like a little village of these small shanties, and you go from one to the other. Yeah, one of them was was tricked out like a like a like a submarine, and they it's all very tongue-in-cheek, so they've got all these kind of kitschy, fun little activities and and things like that. And then the the one that repeat this year from last year was the um people might remember the it was this one was it was called the Club Med or Club Medusa. And it was it's a probably the world's smallest disco tech with with like lighted floor that, you know and, a and a disco ball and a DJ that's playing electronica sort of dance music. It's so fun. And this whole shanties like pulsing and you can fit about you know um you can fit about ten people inside of it, like packed shoulder to shoulder, and everybody sort of just jumping around dancing to this music for three minutes and then they kick you out and then another group comes in. And it it was a great way to warm up 'cause it was cold. So that was fun and then uh and then like on Sunday, um we did a we did another sauna session. So that was fun too. There's these saunas that they set up by the lakes too with the holes cut in the ice um for cold dipping and then the and then the the sauna sits right there by the shore and it's a wood wood fired sauna. So do you do the cold plunge? I didn't plunge because we went to a different lake this year, different sauna this time and and the the hut was or the sorry, the ice hole was kind of far from from shore to the point where and it was kind of windy that day and I thought, you know, like going out and back would have been a little a little painful. So um to cool off I just kinda you just stand out in fifteen degree Fahrenheit
James Stacy breeze and you cool off just fine. Well with the with the art shanties it sounds like they found a way to make Burning Man like freezing man in in sort of a miniature version there out in uh out in your neck of the woods. So that's fun. It's great. Very cool. How about you? Well I'm glad that you're getting out. I'm we've been avoiding going outside. It was uh it's warmed up today. It's just below freezing now. Uh, but we we had like several days in a row of it, you know, bottoming out in the low twenties, uh, negative.. Wow And uh and it's just you know it's too cold to take take the young lad out. He doesn't care for it. He just sits there quietly and doesn't really complain, but he's definitely cold. Yeah. And you know, so otherwise you've just kind of been inside, you know, it's that season when you were reading books and that sort of thing. I uh I've been kind of just laying low doing the dad thing since I got back from Japan as I have to leave on um on Monday for a trip with Tudor. So I'll see her buddy Cole. We'll see if we put an episode together with him for next week, which I uh I'd be excited if that works out. Yeah. I think I had mentioned that I I had been reading King of Ashes by S.A. Cosby. Uh it was good. I enjoyed it. Uh maybe not my genre or my overall like type of book, you know, fictional pseudo crime novel family secrets, that sort of thing. I I liked it. Yeah. It's my first essay, Cosby. Um and then I had also finished uh and I can't remember, maybe I spoke about it and my memory's a little fuzzy on this, but the j I'll blame the whatever I lost to the jet lag there zip in two and from Japan. But I finished uh The Getaway um by Jim Thompson. I I know I'd mentioned that I was gonna be reading it and I've never read anything quite like it. Uh so I definitely think I'm gonna read some more uh some more Thompson and some more of that sort of uh what they called those genres like groin kick novels, and you know, he's known as I guess the dime store Dostroyevsky. Wow. Uh I really enjoyed it. Uh had an an ending that came out of absolutely nowhere for me. And I didn't see it coming. And I and I'll be honest, I didn't even understand what happened. I had to go back and read the ending two, three times uh to kind of catch up with it. But I really enjoyed the book. And uh and I think uh I think tonight, once everything's said and done, I'm gonna start a new one, which is the February book from Jesselnik's book club. It's called Paradise by uh Fernanda Melchor. Uh I don't know what it's about, um, but I'm I'm just kind of reading these indiscriminately. And if I hit a point in the book that I really don't like, I'll just stop. Yeah. So no big deal. But yeah, uh cranking through some books and just prepping for a trip. I leave on Monday. I'm back Friday, so it's a couple of days in in the great we'll call it the Greater Geneva area. If if we're allowed to dis divulge more about the trip and what what we're up to, I'll leave that to uh a possible recording uh with Cole from uh you know hotel room or a uh uh dinner table or something uh next week. So get Cole back on if you can do it. That'll be uh
Jason Heaton he's yeah Cole Pennington four. Yeah. Right. Yeah.wes Aome. That's great. All right. Well, um, before we dive into our chat with Guy, uh Elliot Brown, um, what do you have on your wrist? I can kind of gu
James Stacy ess. Yeah, I'm uh I'm wearing my aerospace. Yeah. Uh so I I mentioned it last week. I have not taken it off. Um I've been using the the minute repeater with some frequency in the middle of the night uh you know to, figure out what time it is, we're keeping the room very dark for my son, uh, who's kind of at the tail end of kind of sleeping in the same room uh and doing that sort of thing. He's having some trouble sleeping. So the minute repeater's been just awesome. I use the alarm to wake up in the morning. I just I don't know the other word for it. Like I'm absolutely smitten by this watch. I absolutely love it. It wears so well. It's so comfortable. They don't look like anything else. They're kind of anti-watch snob, but they're still kind of fancy and snobby a little bit in in a different way, if that makes sense. Uh so like I said on a previous episode, if you happen to miss it, I bought off of the uh TGN buy-sell trade in an E65 362, which is like a around the turn of the millennium uh 40 millimeter titanium aerospace with a sort of steely blue dial that I've really come to enjoy. And this one's just in great condition. I'm wearing it currently on the uh RZE titanium bracelet, which is which is quite comfortable and gives you micro adjust and that sort of thing, which which I've really enjoyed. And yeah, I just I I love this watch. I'm an aerospace guy.
Jason Heaton Yeah, I'm jealous of that one. That's uh that's a great one. I I remember when you got your earlier one, which was an earlier aerospace. Um you had it shipped here and I think I handed it off to you at some point. But um I remember going to pick it up. You handed it off to me at Bas
James Stacy el World. Oh, okay. At the the launch of the bronze Tudor. Oh the first bronze. Uh Black Bay. Huh. Yeah. Cause I I remember it was in like a zippered, a little zippered case is what it had shipped in and you gave it to me and I was like, Yeah, this is this is rad. But it was that night we uh cause we didn't sit together. You were sitting I think with Ross and I was over like with with Ben and a few other folks and then afterwards you you gave it to me. But I yeah, I remember that night pretty clearly. I'm almost positive that's what it was. I was at a tutor event. Yeah, yeah. It would have been was
Jason Heaton that 2014, 2015, something like that. I remember picking it up from FedEx and opening it in the car. Um and I think I probably sent you a picture, but I remember, you know, you told me, Oh, feel free to take it out and try it on. And I would yeah, that was a cool watch. But uh this one Yeah, great bracelet on that one. This one's great. I love the blue and and you know, we had a request on Slack um to play the minute repeater on an episode. I don't know if you're not sure reminding
James Stacy . I'm I'm gonna turn my mic up so I won't say anything because it'll be quite loud for my voice. Okay, All right, there you go. I actually didn't hear anything. I my guess is Zoom would have noise cancelled that for you, but I did see it respond on my meter here on the physicals that we the this is so confusing in inside baseball. Jason, I record the show on Zoom the software. We also record the show on Zoom hardware. Two different brands. Yeah, so confusing. Not not related to to to my knowledge in any way. Uh, but I was able to watch on the meter uh as it showed and uh and we got lucky because we're it's just afternoon, so you got quite a few beeps. Yeah. Uh so I'll do my best to make that listenable and not too quiet, not too loud, all that kind of thing. But yeah, I just I love it. I uh you an anytime that it's in one of the time-telling digital features, so either the blank screen, time and date, digital time, that sort of thing, you can hit the crown and it does the repeater. And man, in the middle of the night, when we're kind of minimizing light and all that other stuff in the room, you can just tap that, even with my wrist under a pillow, I can listen to it and go, oh, okay, so it's the three AM. I'll I'll just I love that. And then the alarm is actually loud enough. The one night I I took the watch off 'cause I was picking my son up and I didn't you know, drag the bracelet across them and I left it on the on the bedside and the alarm's just loud enough to actually wake me from a a re I I don't sleep super well at six a m uh that's towards the end of my cycle. Uh so it it works fine. But yeah, it's uh just such a handy thing and and there are they really there is really nothing quite like the ownership experience. It's so nerdy, but still made at like that two thousand brightling level of quality. Yeah. And uh I I just love it. Yeah. The the only thing that's that I I lament the difference because this is a in many ways a better version than the one I had previously, which was a E56062, um, is the bracelet. And if I can find my way to the that um I don't actually know the term for the bracelet. In the past I've erroneously or I've I've wrongly termed it as a bullet bracelet. The bullet is the chronomat style bracelet. This one is is sort of a a a bar style link. There's nothing there's no bracelet like it. I'll just include it in the show notes. Has this very thin clasp that is also spring kept. Yeah. So it extends on a spring. There's there's no bracelet like it. I'm always surprised that it never broke in my time because I wore that watch all the time when I had it and beat it up and took it on hikes and used it like a like a G Shock. Yeah. And yeah, if I could if I could source one of those and it seemed to fit, I that that might be worth it. I'm I mean, who knows what they some of these bracelets are amazingly expensive uh in in sort of the secondary market. But yeah, the Brightling Air Space. I I I will try and put something on for next week. I'll probably wear a tutor because I won't I'll I'm on a I'm on a trip with Tutor. I'm gonna get to see where where parts of my Peligos were made which I' Im'm excited about. And uh and so yeah, I guess next week I I've I've spoiled the surprise, but I probably won't have the aerospace on. We'll see. And
Jason Heaton how about you? What have you got on? Yeah, well, uh, you know, I thought I'd come come proper for our guest today, and I I pulled out uh my Elliott Brown Holton GMT automatic. Um this is a watch I've had gosh probably two years now, and um I I've got it on a I guess it's a I guess it's a crown and buckle I can't remember what they call this one, the Matt Supreme or something like that. It's a it's just a fantastic uh NATO strap and um yeah this is it it's such a it's such a great watch and you know certainly we get into a bit about the Holton in our in our talk with Guy, but um whenever I put it on I realize I just don't wear this one enough and it's it's just such a handsome watch. It fits in, it kind of slots in with Peligos, C WW CC. Um yep, you know, it's it's it's that it's that classic tool tool watch, you know, black dial, sword hands. Um it's just it's a good looking piece. If if I had one gripe about it, it's a bit big and heavy. I've just I've been wearing a lot of titanium lately and this is a Yeah. I would say this is pretty chunky steel watch. It's forty three millimeters. But uh yeah, it's it's it's really good. Like when you want to wear like a a a big solid you know, do anything watch. Um it's it's tough to beat.
James Stacy So yeah, it's great. Yeah. Yeah, I've got the I have it here just on my desk, but I'm I'm I need to I wanna fit it to its bracelet so I hadn't put it on. But I have the Beachmaster, which is watch you gave me the Nivo colour. The Beachmaster is a watch that I know we talked about when you gave it to me. It's 40 millimeters, 41 at the bezel. I think it's like 50 millimeters lug to lug. So and it's chunky. It wears, I would say it wears a lot like um a standard black bay in steel. Mm-hmm. Right? Kind of has a tall side, lots of lug, great bezel, the rest
Jason Heaton of it. Yeah, and I think you know, the the the brilliant thing about the Beachmaster is the you know it's one of those situations where they they took th they created a solution, a very simple solution to a a request, specifically, I guess it was from the Royal Marines, for s for a watch that could not only track a second time zone but could do count up um and countdown timing. So like that that GMT hand has two arrowheads on it, one of which points to a a scale that allows you to count up uh as a mission timer and then also track the second time zone. And I just I a as well as the dive bezel. And I just think it's it's like one of those elegant solutions that it just took somebody like sitting, you know, scratching their head and like looking at something seventeen times until they thought, huh, if we just put a second hand with a different scale that counts up rather than down. Like we can do a an hourly count up mission timer and then count down. I mean it's i I don't know. It's just it's kind of you know not to compare it to the um the tech gombessa from from Blanc Pan, but again, like they just took a GMT hand on on the the blank pan and made it a three hour timer instead of twenty-four. And it's like I don't know. I like I like simple solutions like that because so often things are just overcomplicat
James Stacy ed. Yeah, there's nothing quite like it. And I mean I I just had to double check because I wasn't sure if I was on the right currency. Eight hundred and fifty bucks. Yeah. Yeah, I know. I mean pretty pretty reasonable for what you what you're getting there. You're gonna spend into the low, very low four figures for an automatic. I think they make a nice watch for sure. Yeah, and I I like that they
Jason Heaton make they they offer quartz and and automatic versions of a number of their watches including the Holton and they do with a Beachmaster too. I mean I just think it's neat to have a a quartz GMT. I mean I think we always think of GMTs as mechanical and um it's
James Stacy uh yeah it's cool. Yeah, and there's it I I think it it's also a nice case study in that there's ways to combat what might be perceived by some enthusiasts as a limitation in the movement, being a collar versus a flyer versus this or that, mm-hmm by making up for it with various elements of dial design and watch design to suit certain modes of use, right? Like I've I've always said that a caller isn't necessarily worse than a flyer. It depends on what you're using. If you're trying to watch somebody else's time zone, a flyer is kind of annoying because you're constantly changing your local. Yeah. Um, but of course the other way around, you're traveling a flyer makes more sense, and this kind of you know attempts to uh resolve in in a different manner, which is kind of clever. All right, so I guess we can get into our main topic, which of course is a a prolonged chat with uh Guy Allen of Elliott Brown watches. He is the brand's head of sales, but uh guy has more than 40 years of working in the watch industry from a Saturday morning job at uh a local retailer to uh being a major part of brands like Zenith and a major retail for brands like Rolex and Patek and JLC and Zenith and and that sort of thing. He has an incredible career. He's a really friendly guy. We've gotten to know him the last couple years through uh crossing paths at the major sort of North American watch shows with Wind Up and then the Toronto Time Peace Show and that sort of thing. And when I started to dig into his history on a on a hangout we had not too long ago in last September, I really thought he'd make a great guest and offer a lot of uh sort of insight into the way the industry has changed over the last few years. So uh without further ado, here is Guy And uh yeah, let's jump right to the tape
Jason Heaton . All right, we have uh with us today Guy Allen from uh Elliot Brown. Guy, you know, I have to say I was telling James before we started recording. Um up until yesterday I did not know your last name, and so you were always just Guy from Elliot Brown. And it was sort of like a guy from Elliot Brown. Um, but it is Guy Allen. A L L E N from Elliot Brown. Uh Guy, welcome to to the Gray NATO. Um what is your what is your title at Elliot Brown?
James Stacy Uh yes, it is head of sales. Exactly that. Yes. Thank you. I'm looking forward to this. Yeah, we're we're pumped to have you on. I I I think you and I first started talking about having a conversation 'cause we don't typically have on people like brand related people to t s sit and chat, but then you and I were on a walk during the Toronto Timepiece show from I think we tried to get a a a seat at the bar at the keg. It was too full. We ended up at a pub down the street. And on the way, you started to give me a little bit of your background and I I immediately had like twenty or thirty questions for you. And I was like, Well, that's that's an episode right there. So uh you have one of the more remarkable histories in that you've been a part of s of watches for quite a long time. You've you've made it a a real part of your life. Uh yes, it's it's it
Guy Allen has been my life, quite honestly. me to say it because it sort of plants me at about 110 years old. But I've been doing this now forty five years. Wow. Which which is just I started actually Exactly, yeah, you're six or seven in the watch minds. Exactly. And it it's it's funny, you know, I was uh I was th thinking it and knowing that we were we were talking, you know, uh uh about that time all that time ago. And it's it's just it's a different world. It it was the world that was a hundred or a hundred and fifty years ago, was the same world that I started in. You know, that uh you know first thing in the morning you did at retail was uh take the the watch repairs out of the safe and wind them up. Because you know, quartz was still, and it sounds ridiculous, quartz was pretty much in its infancy. So still 95% of the watches on people's wrists were were automatic or or m m mechanical in some way. And so you you'd you'd wind up the watches uh in the morning and uh that would be the first job i of of the day. And you you you know you can't and and polishing brass and cleaning glass and you can't you think I you can't imagine anybody Was this at a retailer then were you working in a in a brick and mortar? Yes, I s uh I started out uh in fact at school uh working part time in a in a bricks and mortar retails university uh yeah uh on a saturday and then progressed from from from there. I I I'd finished education uh or doing my A levels, decided I was going to take a gap year and then work there foolish time uh getting money to go on a gap yeah and then never went on the gap yeah. I I I went out for dinner with the guy I worked with and someone he knew uh and the he the guy he knew was the uh HR director or personnel director of as it would have been then uh,, of an old sort of British Empire trading company. Um and they had um all manner of things going on. Um and uh it sounded like an incredibly interesting business. They had uh cruise ships and uh you know uh all all kinds of stuff all over the world. And uh so I phoned the guy up on on my next day off and said, would you interview me for a job? And he said, yeah, of course, no problem. And I went down and uh had the interview and clearly there was no job, he was just being kind. And uh uh uh by sheer serendipity, halfway through the interview, the phone rang. He said, You're gonna have to I need to take this. Um, you know, if you fill out So I filled it out in the app in the in the foyer. Twenty minutes later he came back out and said, What do you know about emeralds? And I said, Oh, absolutely everything. I mean other than they were green. I I knew absolutely nothing about emeralds whatsoever. And uh and he said that's that's lucky that was our emerald bar in in Columbia who's just quit. Would you like the job? I went, absolutely, sounds perfect. He said you uh this was a Wednesday, and he said, uh the only uh slight imperative is that you need to be uh in Venezuela on Sunday. I couldn't even I couldn't have even told you where Venezuela was, to be frank. Uh and there there I was in Caracas on Warley. Buying emeralds. Buying emeralds, yeah. It was the strangest uh As you do, I suppose. Yeah. Uh it was j it was just the strangest thing. Uh part of the things I got was a gun, which uh again was a strange, strange thing. And uh and that that was that was me as as a as an emerald bar, which I did for about six months before that, before I moved within the company. But that was really, I suppose, the start of uh of everything and then um you know went into in in into more sort of you know regular retail for that company and then uh everything sort of flowed from there I guess
Jason Heaton . So was it um your your entree into watches was was via a trading company that handled jewelry and watches, etc. Were you interested in watches? Were you or not so much? Uh yeah,
Guy Allen absolutely addicted to them. Uh in fact I bought uh or I was given a an LED watch probably in about nineteen seventy four or seventy-five. And it and and th those days they were so badly built. If you ran your feet uh on a on a man-made carpet and you could get the spark, they'd re they they'd they'd reset to um yeah the static charge. Yeah they'd reset the to zero hours and uh and I worked that if I soldered a um uh a wire from the battery hatch to the case back it would stop it doing it and uh and i precociously wrote a long letter to the to the company uh tra uh trafalgar watches telling them all about this and they wrote back saying that uh they'd actually worked this out. Thank you very much. Um but they gave they they sent me uh and it was staggeringly beautiful. It was a circular uh L C D watch where the red lens went all the way to the edge and it was touch sensitive. Wow. I was literally the coolest human being at that point in time. It was fabulous. Great. So yeah, I've it's it's it's it has been pretty and and in fact I still got my first watch, which was a um uh a moon uh i it was a moving disc, or it is a moving disc watch, with the uh with with with a with an astronaut doing a uh a moon walk. Wow. On the uh which which I would have got in nineteen nineteen sixty nine or nineteen three. Sure. Yeah. So yeah, you could you could say, um I've often said no one's going to ever employ me to do anything else. But I mean Jason and I feel that way, for sure. Yeah. Right. It's it's a strange thing. I think once you it's it it is addictive. I I think you know, as guys, you know, we are all innate collectors of something or other. But watches it's just it it it it it's so many different things in one isn't it you know it's the aesthetic it's the engineering it's you know it's it's very rarely does anything else come together in that way maybe cars is the only other thing I can think of, whether there's a there's an artistic, an aesthetic, uh uh uh uh uh you know an eng
James Stacy ineering aspect. Yeah, I'd I'd also say watches have a leg up because you can start at five or six. Someone can give you a watch. You can't really get a car. Um I'm I mean I've known growing up in rural parts of Ontario, I've known a couple guys who maybe were a little younger than the learner's permit and and had a set of wheels, but that's not the same. And then and then I I think look watches have gotten very expensive, which I'm sure something we can talk about over over the the progress of the episode, but I I still think they're much more accessible a thing than than a a a car. Um but they do, I think at least certainly for me and Jason, we've talked about this a ton over the years, it's just there is that overlap of yeah, the design, the history, the market position, the this, the the you know, it's it's a factor of twenty things that many of them are shared with with cars.
Jason Heaton So where did you go from um from Trafalgar or not not Trafalgar, but the this trading company. What where did you head from there
Guy Allen ? Uh so I uh I uh I came back to the U So that was mostly uh in in South America and North America. And uh I came back came back to the UK in eighty uh eighty seven. Eighty seven, yeah. And um I applied to a number of watch companies and um I was working for a friend's uh friends jeweler's um just for something to do until I until I got uh and I moved to Guildford, where the shop was. And um I had a uh a phone call on uh the day before Christmas Eve, and it was uh guy called Michael Bamberger who was the uh one of the sort of main board directors of Zenith in those days, and he said to me, Oh, I've got your application, really like to really like to meet you. Could you could you come in for an interview? So I said, Yeah, for sure. You know, you you tell me um w when is possible and uh I'll come in. You say, or tomorrow. I'm like, right, okay, that's New Year's Eve and I'm working for a friend in his shop and that's you know quite a busy day. So I he said, Well I'm going to the US, you know, for a couple of months after that, so it's it's either tomorrow or so of course so I said, Okay, you're in Twickenham, aren't you? Which is you know just outside Lowe. He said, No, no, we're in um we're in La Lochel in switzerland so um so uh the following day I flew to Lalochl and um and and got got the got the got the train from Geneva Airport to Lalochel and uh uh that was picked up by Michael. We we spent about fifteen minutes in his office with him slightly pacing about, not quite sure what I was doing there. And then we got in the car and drove, you know, to an auberge about fifteen hundred metres. And uh with a couple of other directors of Zenith um who uh proceeded to get smashed. Because this was this was their this was their Christmas Eve lunch. And and virtually ignored me the entire time. And uh so eventually event I'm and I'm looking at my watch and where are the hell's this going? So we eventually get back and uh I said so you know what what what what what do we what what are we doing? And he's like, Well, you've got the job, that's fine. And um so I had a race race back to the airport and uh and started in the January. So I I ended up there at Sennis as um a sales manager, working with um a really nice guy um called Mark Hearn, who became the managing director of um of PASEC in the UK. Oh wow
Jason Heaton . What what was the what was the state of uh Zenith in the late eighties? It was a kind of a downtime for them. Well of course they were doing the El Primero for Rolex were just around that time, weren't they? Just as I started, eight
Guy Allen y uh end of eighty six, uh 87 um was exactly the time that that all started. So um we did we in fact had uh old uh new old stock um L Primera movements. Um, so the first brand to take the movement was Ibel for the 1911 chronograph. Oh, yeah. Yeah. That was 70s movements. That was that was not, you know, re-rebuilt uh you know, new stock, that was all new stock um and uh so that's then then royolex happened again eighty eighty seven eighty eight I think uh and that's when it's what that's when it's all kicked off. But we also had Academy in those days and Port Royal, which were which were the were the biggest sellers. The even then the chronograph market, whilst that that launch of the Daytona w was clearly going to be something special, um, it was still small comparatively with with dress watches. You know, if I go back sort of to to my time in retail, we had Patek, we had Oedemar and we had uh Rolex. Um and at that time the the uh Patek and Oedomar didn't mean uh and Jaeger good uh if we sold one a year of those, I'd say that was as much as we ever sold. Uh and Rolex, the two big sellers were the uh bicolour, uh gents and ladies and and the eighteen carat uh day date, eighteen car you know, the uh the the president bracelet at eighteen carat day days. Uh and if we'd sell her at an 18 carat day day, you know, pretty you know, two or three times a week, and you'd be halfway through and somebody would say, Do you do party exchange? And you'd go, Oh God, don't let it be a date owner. Don't let it be a date owner. I've got a date owner. And we would literally give them nothing for for date owners. You'd give them maybe the the the 18 carat day date in those days was six six thousand six hundred and fifty seven pounds, we'd probably give them twelve or thirteen hundred. Uh and if it was a tropic dial, six, seven hundred, they were almost worthless. And in in point of fact, we'd have guys who'd come into the store and want to buy, you know, d to trade Rolexes, you know, guy you know, guys who are on the road and and and had jewelers that didn't sell and and and and so on. And and I'd say to them, well you can have you know three or four of these, but you've got to take all these day toners I've got in my office drawer. I w I once had five daytoners stolen out of my office drawer and I thought, fantastic. At least we'll get some decent money back on the insurance. But that I mean that was it. So it was it was all dress watches. It was bling. It was sort of you know you know not quite Gordon Gecko time but but close to that and it was so it you know so anyway, so we that hit in uh in probably eighty eight, the the Rolex State Owner. Um and um and then went from there, uh then Elite uh came in and and and that's really when the when the sort of uh you know the manufacture side of of Zenith really um really became big elite was huge for us that was the first really big you know uh broadening of a line that that made sense to them and uh and grew. But it was always this you, know it, was always a struggle in the UK. And I think still, you know, there's a lot of of the sort of uh, you know, the the the more should we say independent but but owned by um big companies, those those brands I still think, you know, it's it's touch and go a lot of the time for the for for a lot of those brands. You know, they maybe they've got one or two territories where they do an awful lot of money and and a lot of territories where they don't do very much at all.
Jason Heaton Yeah. As you're you know, as you've worked through decades in the industry, are you um do you find yourself wistful or nostalgic for that era? Like i how how does I it it seems like a softball question, but you know, comparing the the eras of of the watch industry then to now, it sounds rather kind of quaint and you know, winding the watches every morning and you know that sort of thing
Guy Allen . I I think that um um it was quaint, but it was antiquated. You know, we'd we'd gone through the quartz crisis crisis which I didn't quite make, you know, I that that happened for enough sort of five or six years before I started. Um so that the the the the business was pretty much you know 90% jewelry in those days and and uh Seiko was everywhere. I mean every every jeweler in the country had had Seiko uh and and we did and you know, as a as I say, we had PASTEC Rolex uh A A P um and and Seiko, and we'd sell, you know, a hundred Seiko's to to one of anything else. So the Swiss industry really i it was it was on its it was on its um uppers. Um and then Raymond Vale came in. Um, you know, uh they I think they started in seventy-six and they you know, by the mid uh early, mid eighties, early eighties. Um we had a great distributor in the UK and uh and that really really became uh you know design led Swiss watches. And that's that's I think really if if we're honest, what's what started the Renaissance again is is it's it wasn't just you, know, grand adad's thirty-six mil watch with a date on a black leather strap with a champagne dial. Th the th they they were watches that had been someone had put a bit of thought behind them and and and that when we had those that really suddenly started shifting again. So So I I I I know I much prefer where we are now. I think where we are now is unquestionably the most interesting period in the last forty odd years, without a shadow of doubt. It's it's it's it's a real it's a real sea change. I think, you know, maybe I'm jumping the gun a bit, but you know, i i if I look at um all the things that uh you know when I started in the jewelry and watch business, you know, we sold cigarette lighters, we sold you know, we were called jewelers and fancy goods stores and we'd sold we'd sell um compacts and and and you know uh tea sets and I mean it just went on and on and on. Well all of that all of that m malarkey over the course of the years disappeared because nobody wanted this stuff anymore. Because it's just, you know, it's it sits there gathering dust until you die and then someone chucks it out for you. Um but what happened probably 10-15 years ago was a lot of branded silver brands disappeared out of the traditional marketplace because they'd become big enough brands in their own right to have their own retail spaces. So again, that reduced. And I think that particularly now independent watch brands have become we've become a category in our own right. You know, as um uh bricks and mortar retail has its its own uh issues and and and and problems um I don't think that alters the fact that people want to feel tribal, they want to feel part of a a gang, they want to feel part of a uh uh you know l you know i in every sense part of something bigger and and collecting and and being part of something is is important. And I think that has allowed independent watch brands to really um materially change the metric i in how that whole thing has has has has has ramped up spectacular
James Stacy ly. Yeah. I you know, I'm curious I mean, we're talking softball questions. Let me throw one out there that may be softball, but I just don't know your answer. So maybe not. Is in that span of time you came in after quartz, um, you were involved with kind of larger brands, the distribution, the retail, that sort of thing. Would you say that the the the number one change between your sort of start in professional watches to now is is the internet or is it or is it that tastes have changed? Is that brands have all pushed up market? I think it's a number of things.
Guy Allen I think um our industry was always the people first industry. It was always very, you know, people focused. And I think over the course of time, as the Spriss the Swiss brands became more dominant, more or more global in their marketing approach, more dominant in their in their financial appeal, it became very much a numbers game. Um and I think that was all it's it's a necessary thing of business, of course, but I think it became a a detrimental um a detrimental issue. Um, you know, prices just kept going up and going up and going up and and and it became far less uh of a uh of an exciting thing other than a status thing, you know, from a collector's point of view. I it just bec I think that that's sort of died a little bit. You know, there was there was the big trend in the eighties and early nineties for for heritage watch collecting. Uh I think that died off uh i into the early two thousands because it just became so fundamentally focused on on um uh on on on you know making the making the buck about adjacencies, which you know, that's a dreadful word, but you know, we we won't be there unless you've got X and Y and it just became every anybody that wasn't in that group got sidelined. Um and I think the world was poorer for that, actually. Uh so I don't think it was the internet. I think what the internet's done has given us the scope to be who we are as independent brands, because you you know, the the always the difficulty with with the internet was, you know, you've got great guys like yourselves who talk uh i infinitely about a whole bunch of watches and uh and and end consumers can listen to you and they can you know go on the brand's websites and and get peer to peer review, whatever it is, forums, when they go into a retail store, they are more informed than in the vast majority of instances than a sales association sales association in a resale store. So the only question that can be asked is is there any is there any discount on this? Because you can't say you know Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you have it in stock and is there any discount? Because other than that, there's there's no there's no there's no conversation. It's not well tell me about the watch because you know about the watch. So I just think that whole thing became a bit sterile. Um and I and I think um then then what's happened with with the internet, with sorry, with the independent brands has has really reignited the way that that we that that we um that we understand brands and the way that we buy brands. And I think people like yourselves, uh I I've got an awful lot of time for the guys at Time and Tide as well. Oh yeah, of course. Uh who who I think are doing a really, really interesting job. You know, that uh I don't know the Melbourne studio, but the London studio is is very much a a hangout, is a clubhouse for collectors and and and I think that all everything everybody's doing in their own way uh is is creating that zeitgeist that interest. Uh I I'll say it, but Jen will hate it that vibe. Uh for Jen. Some reason she hates the word vibe. Um but I think it's it's created a real um you know a moment f for for independent brands to become much bigger and uh uh in in people
Jason Heaton 's understanding, which is fabulous. You've you've really had to um obviously evolve yourself. You know, I'm not gonna make a comment about your age, but you know, you did mention how many years you've been in the industry and and from from you know selling T-sets and and sourcing emeralds and winding watches in the morning to what I working for brand that I think represents uh you know, really this the state of kind of it's such a different, very modern brand, Elliot Brown. I almost would say it operates in a in a space that that has popped up in the past decade or so of brands that are almost you're almost marketing it like um like outdoor gear or adventure products, re more so than, you know, uh strictly a a timepiece. You know, timepiece watches have this kind of stale sort of very um you know, or can, I shouldn't say they do, but you know, some some of the bigger brands like Tudor do a nice job. But but when I think about in your space at your price point and looking at your website and social media, like it's really all about people doing stuff, wearing these watches. And I think that that's and it's it just feels very modern. I
Guy Allen think it is, but I think it's it's that um I I I I get what you're saying about, you know, is it more an outdoor brand or a watch brand? Actually, we're a hundred percent a watch brand. Um we're a hundred percent a watch brand who understand our customer base uh uh very, very well um and understands their need for something um that is to a tool watch uh and it's an easy easy description but it really is it's something that they can use. Whether they are wearing the eighteen carat Rolex uh at the weekend or whether they're wearing, you know, whatever it is, um our customers wear E B as a badge of honour doing the thing they love most in the outdoors. Um and I think that's that's the skill is is understanding our customer base, leaning into that really. Um and I I think, you know, going from from you know back at the beginning of my career, I I don't think there's that much of a change. It's really, really only ever about understanding your customer to you. If if if you're just uh you know uh trying to please all of the people all the time, you're gonna fail because that's just not a feasible
Jason Heaton thing. What do you what do you think is is kind of a bit of a follow-up, but I I'm just thinking about there are a lot of brands that that and I'm not gonna name names, but they they feel compelled if they get a little bit of success to sort of expand into territories or or areas or types of watches that maybe don't suit their audience so they feel like well we need to do a complicated piece or a moon phase or a or a dress watch or a gold watch or whatever
James Stacy . We absolutely we absolutely must Ye
Jason Heaton ah. Like like Yeah. I mean I I just find it's it's it it exists outside the watch space too, companies that they reach an inflection point where they they don't do things well anymore. You know, there's a tipping point where they they get too big for their britches or however you want to phrase it. W uh
Guy Allen we very early, um, you know, uh over a decade ago now, started with this uh pillars. Um we have f four pillars. Um uh and every time we introduce something new, it's it's got to sit within one of those pillars. And if it doesn't, we don't do it. You know, we we we have design meetings and you know there's blood on the walls at the end of it because you know we're w one of us is or two of us are adamant that we should do X and then the other two are like, no, we can't because it doesn't fit in the pillars. You know, we are launching this year a Mark II version of our Canford, which was our first watch, which was it's uh it's a compressor style case, double crown, um, and and therefore it's it's um it's a much more uh a much less military, much more less outdoor watch, but still with all that DNA. So you know we will do. We we it last year we did the uh the heritage diver in summer colours, you know, the it was an English uh beach holiday that we chose as our as our marketing story, which Jem um did fantastically. And we we really put it work worked a lot and we we did it as a limited edition rather than we sold out of all of those. Uh this summer you'll see something in Arn which is equally spectacular and and fun. So we we we can be playful and we can do things, but it will always, always only stretch the DNA. It won't break it and turn into uh you know a diamond wrapper's watch or
James Stacy or whatever whatever it yeah. You know, I I'd love to rewind just a little bit 'cause we jumped kind of into the middle or even the even the right now for for uh Ellie Brown. How how did you get involved with Ellie Brown? How did the brand find you? Uh, I'd love to know kind of the origin story there. I had been
Guy Allen running a French brand in the UK called Pecina, um, which was uh is a manufacture brand. Um, and I've been doing that for about eight years. And we had been, you know, very successful, really, in terms of a uh a small French watch brand that no one can pronounce. Um we'd we'd done very well. They'd gone bust in France. Um I'd been doing a smartwatch project that um uh a Bluetooth smartwatch project which Brightling had bought into the technology for uh we'd finished doing that and uh I was sort of, you know, sort of hankering after doing something else. And a friend of mine um phoned me and she said, I've just had a conversation with Ian Elliott. Uh they're looking for a sales director. Um she said, I think you'd be perfect for it. Weirdly, about eight weeks before I'd had a conversation with Ian about this Bluetooth watch because it was a it was uh we we were looking at it as a as a yachting type watch and and of course I at that point E B was just getting involved in uh the clip around the world yacht race. So I phoned Ian and said, Hi, it's me, as you remember. He said yes. So I came down and uh the interview took about five minutes. We discussed Hyatt jeans, which we were both wearing and uh that was it. So it was a it was a uh it was a quick conversation. We you know, I think uh I understood where Ian and Alex w uh w w wanted to be, were going, um you know that they'd the uh they came from Animal, which is a s uh uh was a surf brand in the UK still still exists today. Um so everything they'd done had been very much outdoors. Um so they weren't necessarily imbued in the way I was with the history and the watch industry. So it was it was sort of a marriage made in heaven really that you that I could bring um a certain flavour and a certain understanding of uh of of moving it into a more mainstream marketplace, but keeping that DNA, as I mentioned before. And uh and and that was uh yeah that was over a decade ago now. Yeah, because the brand the brand
James Stacy founded in twenty thirteen. Yes. Yeah I started in twenty fifteen. I'm interested you you you're talking about that you had a skill set that was gonna allow them to become essentially a a more fully established brand, but not forgetting where they came from. What what what do you feel you brought from your the previous companies you worked with and your experiences that were like really important in the tool set to help a brand, the size, the scope, the sort of there's a lot of personality in from the two founders in LA Brown that still exists today. If you look through the watches. How did how did you kind of approach that? What was the what was the plan? Because growth can destroy all of that, which we kind of alluded to previously. Yeah, again
Guy Allen , uh in initially, uh a a clear I have a have had for you know for a long time here uh doing this so a clear vision of where the industry is going, what's happening, um, why it's happening, um, and and you can't live as the brand in splendid isolation. Um you have to um play on the same playing field. You know, it doesn't matter if you're um uh uh to use the soccer analogy, i you know, semi professional or playing in the premiership, you're still playing eleven guys on the pitch uh and you're still scoring goals and trying to defend. We're all going to be strikers 'cause it's a d recipe for disaster. So it's it's having that initial right, this is you know, there's a framework here that we have to work to. However what we're doing is unique to us, we've still got to play in that, in that, in that framework. So I think that I think also, you know, I I had a very good relationship with most of the b main buyers in the UK, which gave us uh a lot of e easy conversations to have and and build uh build an understanding. You know, Rome wasn't built in a day and you're never going to walk through the door and uh with a brand like Elliot Brown in the first instance, and um uh uh because it's you know people don't know it, etc. But it it so a a lot of things. And actually, really as the brand has evolved, the industry has evolved alongside it much quicker than it's ever done before. So we're we find ourselves at a point now where um March last year, uh the same uh yes, March 2025, we decided to close all our retailers. We started 2013 as a very traditional wholesale to retail watch brand, um with with a little bit of e-commer on the side. And then of course special projects came along, which grew the brands uh as well. Um, and over the course of time it it it has been ever more difficult because of the things we've already talked about to to penetrate uh you know meaningfully a um uh uh a retail space. The the independent retail space is declining so fast that that in you know in in ten years will it be here? I doubt it very much in the same way that it is now. Um multiple retail space is is so overcrowded that you you know you're one of nine hundred brands standing in a queue hope hoping that you're gonna get in there. And over the course of time, we'd built such a reputation that that we just that that it became apparent that we could do this on our own. You know, we we were having significant double digit growth year on year, uh and and most of that was not coming from retail. And therefore it became obvious that that the thing that had started w for us had become the least valuable parts of our business. And I think if I go back to uh twenty twenty two, twenty three, um, you guys were very, very instrumental in our in our growth in North America. Um, you know, you you you'd started showing us a lot of love, um uh and and that was coming back at us. We could see that. Um and and I said, I think this is the point where we make a leap and and and move into the American market because we're clearly a watch is g it's going to go down well. The the style and look and feel and the and the customer base e is probably larger there than it is anybody anywhere else in the world. And so that that that um culminated as in as is you know working with uh with wind up uh with one wound and with other other people to to start that process. And wow has that has that uh m m made a massive difference. We are in in an entirely different world now sitting here in 2026 than we were back then in 20
Jason Heaton 23. Yeah, we we've seen a lot of you in North America here in the past few years. I was starting to wonder if you were living here or something, but um I I want to get into the the challenges of of of the American market, especially within the past year, given tariffs and that sort of thing. But I I just want to touch on something you briefly mentioned about special projects. And with with every with every brand, it seems like there's a point, there's an inflection point where the like the the graph goes vertical. And I feel like with Elliot Brown, correct me if I'm wrong, the Holton, when the Holton became a UK Special Forces watch. It feels like the reputation of the brand, it it just it it gained some notoriety or some something with that watch that put it on the map for a lot of people. Is that fair to say? And can you maybe go into the background of that a little bit
Guy Allen ? Uh yes, it's absolutely fair to say. Uh uh a hundred percent we we had made a watch for their association, which was a Canford, um and uh that had gone down very, very well. And and then we were asked could could we we make something in conjunction with them? And uh and of course that became the Holton it started out with a with a sapphire bezel and uh a different works in tali really. And uh uh and and over the course of of months um morphed into the Holton as we know it today. And and yes, that was hugely uh influential in in in in the in the special project side of the business. It it's it it it it changed the metric completely. We we suddenly started getting uh a lot of um a lot of work in the in the UK and in in you know in the in Europe. And then uh and then quite quickly in the US. We you know, we sort of slightly jokingly in the i in in E B c say that, you know, it it's our speed master, the Holton. It's it's it's um f for want of anything better, it's an iconic watch that that has made us uh the brand that we are today, without a doubt. Uh and actually it's the it's the the Holton's um tenth anniversary next year. Oh and we've just we've just had a meeting uh last week uh on on what we're doing for that. So there's
James Stacy some some very exciting things to come. Oh that,'s fantastic. I I remember uh because the brand was new to me. It came to me from Jason, and I remember him saying, I've got this watch, you've got to check it out. It's the the the uh the beachmaster Nivo. I would I would kind of echo Jason's curiosity about, you know, pulling back from your retailers. I mean, I'm I'm not putting this in the correct um order, but you know, diving into the US market, being part of the show circuit, um, that's how we kind of got used to seeing you more often. And then in Toronto and Vancouver and these sorts of things. How has that because I it feels like for a lot of brands, not just for you, obviously I know a few other brands that go to similar shows. Uh it's been a real mixed bag, uh, operating in this market because of tariffs, because of other considerations, uh some instabilities, and then you have the pluses of the show circuits and that sort of thing. How has it been for a a British brand sort of operating in that space? Um Um i
Guy Allen it perhaps wasn't my best idea um in hindsight to to to suggest we close all our um all our retailers in the UK and focus heavily on the US just prior to tariffs coming into the place. That could have been a disaster. And we did uh for about six to eight weeks when the you know when we had that massive uh tariff situation right at the beginning, we we just switched off. Um, you know, we we we sat there with bated breath in in the hope that things would change. And of course they did. And you then think, well, okay, we've lost a lot. But in point of fact, it was just a dam, because then the the the the sales immediately after we we got rid of those big tariffs were huge. So we really got back what we'd potentially lost in that sort of eight week period. What I'd love to be able to see, but of course you can't is is where we would have been without the tariffs, but where we have been with tariffs is been very happy, really. Um you know, it's it's it's been a little more costly, of course. In some instances, it's it's been an absolute pain. Um we shipped uh eighteen watches, exactly the same watch on a project, uh, and we got charged uh eighteen different duties. Uh so clearly uh it was all done in such a rush. No nobody had the first idea what they would do. We had one watch that there was when we looked at the code, it was something about uh could it have been uh animal feeds which weren't allowed in to the US and it's like seems unlikely. Um and then they said, yeah, no, no, we've we've looked at it, we've investigated and it definitely isn't animal feeds that are not allowed into the US. And we're like, Great, so we're back down to the original Oh no, there's a two hundred dollar uh uh charge for investigating as to whether that was animal feed. Uh so it has it's been it's been challenging. But I I have to say I I've I've spent a lot of time working in the US in in my career uh and and Canada and I really enjoy it. Uh it's a different different thing to to Europe. And we're very privileged to be able to do it, I think, and and and and bear the success with that. And so it would have been great to see it otherwise, but in in in the ways that and the issues and problems that we faced in the last eighty
Jason Heaton months, it's been fine. Which uh which shows are you doing? Um, over on this side of the pond uh this year gonna do all the wind ups or how which ones are you doing?
Guy Allen Uh uh we're doing uh Dallas and we're doing New York, uh 'cause we've done everything um for the last two years. So uh we're doing uh Dallas, New York, we're doing New York um in um the week uh week after next uh intersect uh and then we're doing Toronto. Are you gonna do Toronto again? Uh we're doing Toronto, we're doing Vancouver. Great. We're just changing kids up a little bit. This is the and we're doing more uh we we did a show in Prague last year, we're doing a show in Germany this year and a show in um in Warsaw this year. And so we're we're you know we're broadening our appeal more sho
Jason Heaton ws in the UK as well. So I'm constantly amazed at how um I was looking at the website in preparation for this and and just the the the price point to and this isn't I'm just not just blowing smoke here. Um I you know, the the price point of LA Brown watches for what you get in the watch is quite remarkable. I mean, I think, you know, um certainly that has to do with, you know, your sourcing and manufacturing and and all of these sorts of things and the the way you price things, whatever. But it's it's it must be a really fun brand to work for because it's a i you have a compelling story and and a great um price point. Yeah, it is. And that's it that's the ethos that Ian
Guy Allen and Alex have fostered from from the very beginning and and and and it and it you're right, it it works brilliantly and yes it is great and and I feel very privileged to do it. You know, w I uh having not wanted to keep going on about the forty five years. But that's what I was saying earlier, that actually it's better now than it's ever been. Um uh it it's it's more exciting, there's more to do. It's it's it's a nice brand to work for,
Jason Heaton that's for sure. Anything you can share about uh the coming year that uh even hint at that that we should be keeping an eye on well uh uh
Guy Allen on summer colours, that's gonna be very exciting. Um that's been a good collection for you. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Well the the uh that was quite funny because we um we launched it um not last year, the year before last and and in Chicago and um and we we we uh Ian was doing a show in London. Jem and I were in Chicago and we were we were talking about how we launched it and and with a time difference. If we launched on at nine o'clock in Toronto, it would have only been an hour before Ian's show started in um i in London. So I'm like, yeah, that's fine, let's let's do that. So Jem sets it off at about five to nine. Um I I said to her uh about five past, I'm like, if we had any traction yet, she's like, I won't say it, but she's like, oh dear. Um, we'd sold the entire production out in three minutes. So so neither of us got to sell any arms. So we we try hard to to make it an understandable collection, an understandable family, understandable brand. But at the same time, yeah, it's the yeah, so that and and Camford two point oh this year. Um so yeah sterile Holton. Yeah there'
James Stacy s lots lots to lots to look forward to. That's exciting. Well, look, guy, it was uh it's an absolute treat to have you on. You have such an incredible background um supporting the idea of people liking watches, and I think that comes through with your help at at Elliot Brown. I do think the products stand out really nicely in the category. And uh and I think it's just an absolute blast to have you on the show. But uh I I'm also excited. I guess I'll I I should be able to see at Vancouver. We'll certainly see at Toronto. Yes, yes. We're looking forward to it. Okay. We we had a very good Toronto uh last year, so Fingers crossed the weather repeats in Vancouver from last year. I doubt I doubt it, just throwing it out there
Guy Allen . Forty consecutive days of rain in the UK, so frankly anything is better than this.
James Stacy There you go. Well look, hopefully you can stay dry out there. Thanks so much for coming on. It's an absolute treat to have you on the show and we're excited to cross paths this coming year. It it's been a it's been a joy being here, guys. Thank you
Jason Heaton very Great stories. Um and love the brand. Love seeing him. Can't wait to to to meet him again in Vancouver uh this fall. And uh yeah, just thanks to uh thanks to Elliot Brown for organizing that and to Guy for making the time to come on. Absolutely. All right. So what do you say we jump into some final notes? Sure thing. Yeah. I'll go first. This is actually uh your Christmas gift to me that I've been using daily and every time I use it, I love it. And I just I it's become such a part of my daily life that I've actually kind of forgot that I wanted to talk about it on a on a final note. And this is uh from a brand um I'm not sure if they pronounce it vessel but it's V S S L. Um they kind of uh sort of this high-end camp outdoor, sort of food related, coffee related products. Um, this is their Java G45 coffee grinder. Um, you sent this to me with with uh kind of a nice little package of kind of camping related gifts uh at Christmas. And I had seen this before um and just thought I don't really have need for a a camping coffee grinder. Yeah. Turns out I haven't gone camping yet, but I use this every day. Uh, you know, I've got a I've got a big bur grinder, um, electric burr grinder that sits on the counter, but there's some tactile pleasure in grinding coffee by hand in this unit, which is um I I I hadn't actually looked at the website and noticed how much you paid for this thing, but it it's it it's not cheap. Um but I will say that for two hundred and twenty dollars, you know, everything's relative. It's worth every penny. I mean it's really well manufactured, it's it's this beautiful machined anodized aluminum, um, with you know a you know full metal burr set for grinding the beans, and and it grinds the perfect amount to fill the portafilter on my espresso machine, and that's how I use it. It has 50 grind settings that you just adjust by satisfyingly clicking the uh the setting um inside. Um and then the the the catch for the the grounds kind of screws into the bottom. Really well machined. Everything fits together really well. It's easy to use. Um cranking it by hand is a good workout and a great way to wind an automatic watch. Um and it's just, yeah, it's just a it's a sheer pleasure. The the the the handle folds out, you put a little um knob on it for that's magnetic, and then you you crank it and you can shut it and it turns into a little carabiner that you could clip to a backpack or whatever. Um I just can't say enough good things about it. It's it uh you know, combined with it with a a good coffee bean, like it it's just made the morning espresso just so pleasurable. I just love using
James Stacy it. Oh man, I'm I'm so I'm so glad that you like it. It's one of those things I don't own, but I have seen in person once, and I was just so impressed. And then you see the number and you kind of go, Really? Yeah. I guess. And then you're like, Yeah. I was like, you know what? Even even if you only and I I didn't expect you to use it at home. I thought maybe, you know you'd get out when the camping season starts and use it 10-15 times this summer or something. And uh even with that, just elevating that experience with the and again, like it's a cry once buy once sort of price, you can definitely get less expensive. I think Harryo makes a very well-regarded hand grinder, but this is this is not the one that that's well regarded. This is the this is like the one. And uh and yeah I'm I'm just thrilled to hear that you're enjoying it. Any money spent on something as silly as just making the coffee a little bit better or a little bit more enjoyable is fine by me. Yeah. And and when I saw this and I was kind of like I said you or like you mentioned putting together sort of a camping themed kit. I guess of all the things that that you got, that's probably the one you could use at home if you're if you're willing to forego the loud electric grinder first thing in the morning. Yeah. Uh so yeah, I'm I'm thrilled, man
Jason Heaton . That's great. Yeah, it's it's fantastic. It's it just creates you know, it adds to the ritual of making coffee and something about grinding it by hand just kind of just kind of imbues the whole process with this this very manual process and and takes a little bit of extra time and it's just so satisfying to use it. It truly feels like a a well and it is a well-built, well-engineered, machined, you know, piece of machinery. And it's uh it's you know, for those of us that like our cars and our watches and film cameras and that sort of thing. It's it's the same hits the same part of the brain. So it's great. Good stuff. Nice. Oh good. Glad to hear it
James Stacy . All right. What do you have? You got some exciting news. I do, yeah. News I've been sitting on for some time. Amazon has finally announced that the grand tour will return, and part of the cast is a a previous TGN alum and one of my favorite YouTubers and a good pal of mine, Thomas Holland. Uh he'll be joined by James Engelman, the the two of them together. That's Throttle House. If you haven't seen any of their stuff and you like cars, you're really missing out. And uh and then finally the the third for the show will be Francis Bourgeois, uh who's like probably best known for his social media videos about trains? But if you dig around, he did some videos with Chris Harris that were more car focused or specifically car focused, some car and train focused. I I find him quite entertaining and and the few times that I've seen him been being given the chance to become to go deeper on something and and kind of step outside the the TikTok length of of one of his funny train videos, quite fascinating. Uh you know, definitely a car guy. Um and anyways, uh this news was finally announced, I think, just in the last week, and uh and it was a big moment for Thomas and for James, and I'm sure for Francis as well. And uh I wanted to highlight that and and thankfully I made it even easier because I I you know there there was you know videos of of um Jeremy Clarkson you know fake stamping people's resumes and not picking them but picking the the guys that they did and that sort of thing. M moreore interestingly for me, the fellows from Smith and Sniff, um, which is uh Richard Porter and Johnny Smith, they have a great podcast, one of my favorite car podcasts, really nicely produced. They have great perspective. Richard Porter, if you're a top gear nerd or or a grand tour nerd, like spent the more than 20 years as a script editor between those two shows. So like really understands what makes Top Gear Top Gear, what made the Grand Tour, the Grand Tour, and that sort of thing. And so they sit down and talk of just for part of an episode about the process behind putting these uh the new hosts together and and all the hoops they had to jump through and all these sorts of things. And it's it's a great chat. It's maybe 15 minutes uh starts around 23 minutes into the show uh for uh a recent episode they did called how the new grand tour presenters were chosen and i highly recommend it if you're if you're planning to watch the new grand tour if you're a fan of you know the the previous iterations of of these sorts of shows that had Clarkson and May and Hammond. Uh I think this is going to be a real hit. Um and and I'm really excited to see it come together. I know they've been filming it and they'll be filming it and that sort of thing. And uh yeah, big news, I think, and and certainly for a good friend of mine and a guy who's been on the show a couple times, uh, I think uh I think it'll be great. Um and and I think that's where we're uh where a little bit of background and context if you're not sure who these guys are that sort of thing could help and and the Smith Sniff podcast they do a good job. That's great and it is exciting news
Jason Heaton and I I I you know congratulations to the guys for for this huge career move. Um I I think it'd be fun and I'm I'm sure you can arrange it, or hopefully you can, um if he's got time to get Thomas back on sometime and you know maybe when they've got a few well, they do have a few under their belt if they've been filming for some time. But uh yeah, I just can't imagine the produ So it'd be fun to get a peek behind the curtain if he's willing to come on again
James Stacy sometime. Yeah, I don't you know I I don don't't want to speak for Thomas simply because he now works for Amazon uh like James Bond does and and that sort of thing. So he'll there might be approval metrics, hopefully hopefully you know, we uh we're we're able to um to to crack through that. But I I'd be obviously there's no there's no limitation there. I'd love to have Thomas back on. I'd love to have James on to talk about it as well. I'm I'm you know a long term fan of Top Gear in the Grand Tour and I'm excited that, you know, it's people I recognize and whose content I already really love, uh kind of carrying that forward. I I'm not sure they could have picked somebody better if you're a big YouTube uh car person. I think you'll know uh James and Thomas's videos and and how they they do have that what I think is that kind of really necessary chemistry and sense of humor. Even even just the announcement, which I'll I'll find the I'll find the video from Instagram and and include it, but even just their announcement video was hilarious. Uh so yeah, it was it's it's a good time, and I'm I'm I'm awfully proud and and just excited to have the show back in general. Well that's great. Yeah, that was uh that's a long episode, but but a lot of good stuff in there. Yeah, absolutely. Well, look, as always, thank you so much for listening. If you'd like to subscribe to the show notes, get into the comments for each episode, or even consider supporting the show directly, which could net you uh TG Inside NATO, access to the Slack, etc. etc. etc., please visit thegraynato.com. Music throat is siesta by jazzar via the free music archive. And
Jason Heaton we leave you with this quote from Gene Youngblood who said: an interested person is an interesting person.