The Grey NATO – 324 – Watches And Wonders 2025 Megasode
Published on Thu, 10 Apr 2025 06:00:00 -0400
Synopsis
In this lengthy episode of The Grey NATO podcast, hosts James Stacy and Jason Heaton discuss the 2024 Watches and Wonders trade show in Geneva. James attended the show while Jason opted to go camping instead. They cover major releases from brands like Rolex, Tudor, IWC, Breitling, Zenith, Tag Heuer, and Nomos, analyzing the new watches from both technical and aesthetic perspectives. A key highlight was the new Rolex Land Dweller and Tudor's white-dial Pelagos Pro. They also discuss industry news like the US tariff announcement that disrupted the show's normal flow. The hosts share detailed hands-on impressions of various watches, with particular enthusiasm for the new Nomos Club Sport Neomatic World Timer and Tag Heuer's revived Formula 1 line. The episode concludes with their "Final Notes" segment featuring interesting articles and media recommendations.
Links
Transcript
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| James Stacy | Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Graynado. It's a loose discussion of travel, adventure, diving, driving gear, and most certainly watches this episode 324. And it's proudly brought to you by the always growing TGN supporter crew. We thank you all so much for your continued support. And if you'd like to support the show, please visit thegraynado.com for more details. My name is James Stacy and I'm joined as ever by my friend and co-host Jason Heaton. Jason, how are you doing? |
| Jason Heaton | I'm probably a little more coherent and awake than you are after your week away. But then again, I don't know. It's still early in the morning, so maybe you're... Yeah, I'm going to bed pretty early. |
| James Stacy | That's kind of the way the jet... I think I ran out of steam about 10 p.m. last night. It's respectable. uh so that's not so bad i mean you know it's one of these things and we'll get into how the show was this year for sure that's the point of these episodes i also just realized this would be our essentially our ninth anniversary of the topic of our first episode yes indeed which was from shh in 2016 which is kind of fun it was called all lucks out i think and then by the time we got to basel world which is now kind of what the timing of Watches and Wonders is, that kind of early spring sort of scenario. But by the time we got to that, we moved on to this Megasode format. So if you're first to a Megasode, welcome. We're going to talk about an awful lot of watches today, and we're really not in that much of a rush. These episodes can go a little bit long, hence the title. Please feel free to get a snack. Please feel free to cut it into multiple chunks. |
| Jason Heaton | Hydrate. |
| James Stacy | Normally, we try and stick to an hour. Today, I won't really be watching the clock that carefully. But we're going to get to all that kind of stuff in a moment. We've got lots to catch up on because we didn't do an episode last week because I was in Geneva for the show. But Jason, we finally get to share the number from our firefighting t-shirt that we made with the illustrated watch and with a couple other friends from the Slack community. Why don't you get to share some of that news? Because this is something I'm excited about and I think you too. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, definitely very excited because, you know, and this seems like such a long time ago. And just to refresh people's memory, you know, we had news of those horrible wildfires in California over the winter. And an idea was brought to us by John Iwata, who's a Twin Cities based firefighter. And he suggested that we maybe put together a t-shirt to raise some funds to donate to a worthy cause out in California. So we partnered with the Illustrated Watch, our good friend Tony, who designed kind of a small TGN-based logo that incorporated parts of the California state flag and a slogan around the firefighting effort. And we sold some t-shirts. We sold a lot of t-shirts and people really responded. And over the months of January and February, we raised, drum roll please, $10,732. From t-shirts. From t-shirts. After cost, so you know, after the cost of doing all this and the shipping and that sort of stuff, that was actually the amount that we donated to the California Fire Foundation. And the California Fire Foundation is a non-profit that was brought to our attention by another firefighter friend and avid longtime listener, uh, Asha Wagner based out in Northern California. And, um, she suggested the California fire foundation. And so that's, uh, that's who we went with and they, and they work to provide funds and relief to firefighters and families and people affected by, by fires in California. And so, um, I sent a check off to them, gosh, it's probably coming up on three over three weeks ago. And we meant to, mentioned it on a previous episode, but it slipped our minds. So here we are. And it makes me very proud of our community that people really responded and rose up and gave so generously. And so we're just thrilled to be able to donate over $10,000 to an incredible cause. So thank you to everyone. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, and in the past, we've done a few of these things where we've done, you know, Instagram, like, silent auctions, if you will. Yeah. Or, you know, like, comment auctions on Instagram, and we've had to give away a watch, and it's like, the one time, it was a fairly rare watch, a watch that I love, my C4, or first-gen C4 in pastel with the 12-hour bezel, and I'm more than happy to have auctioned it off for a good cause, but if I had known we could have done maybe double, Just from t-shirts. Yeah. Yeah, you know I think this works out well And it's always I'm always pumped whenever I see one of these t-shirts like pop up on Instagram And I got to see cold this past week, and I know he got one and that kind of stuff So yeah, it's it's it's super cool and definitely something we're gonna consider in the future when when opportunities arise. Yeah Yeah, really thrilled about that |
| Jason Heaton | And kind of switching over to a different mode here, but related to merchandise in that kind of general sense. Stay tuned because we have a rather exciting collaborative merchandise drop coming pretty I would say within the next, let's say, four to six weeks by the time we kind of get our acts together. Maybe sooner, maybe a little later, but in time for summer. We've got a few fun ideas, so we can't say much more about it now, but definitely stay tuned. There'll be some fun stuff coming up with one of our long-time And then I have one more little bit of housekeeping that I just feel like I need to make it as a regular reminder because we occasionally get emails or questions or even subscription cancellations from people that are questioning why we're doing this. Um, their, you know, annual subscription amount or even monthly subscription amount is coming to their credit card with the name swim proof LLC on it. And if you don't recognize that, that's my business name. And that's kind of the, the business under which we handle the TGN finances. Um, So, you know, if you see the name SwimProof, S-W-I-M-P-R-U-F in like a credit card bill or something and wonder, you know, why it's there for a certain amount, it's likely either you're subscribing to my SwimProof substack or to TGN. So it could be one or both of those. So if you see that, that's what it's for. I'll try to do these regular reminders just because we do get questions occasionally, but that's just, A little bit of housekeeping at the top, but yeah, that's about it from my side. |
| James Stacy | Well, I'm curious because I think a lot of what I did will come up in the main topic. You didn't go to Geneva, and I have to admit as much as I love being in Geneva and seeing all the watches, what you did get up to this past weekend looked pretty dang good on the internet. What have you been up to with the last little while? |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. You know, as I mentioned a while back, I actually opted out of watches and wonders this year. And I think it was the right choice for me. You know, I did miss the, you mentioned there was some, we'll get to it in a bit, but the nice weather in Geneva. And I do remember April being a very pleasant time there last year and it was really nice. But instead, I went camping. So my girlfriend and I loaded up the Defender this past weekend and we headed about three hours south of here to the very southeastern corner of Minnesota, an area called the Driftless Region, which implies that it was left untouched by the glaciers. And so there's a lot of kind of bluffs and river valleys and, you know, kind of beautiful limestone and sandstone cliffs and things. And we found this quite small, lesser known state park called Beaver Creek Valley State Park and just got a campsite there. We slept in the back of the Defender, grilled some good food over a campfire, the pleasures of morning coffee at a campsite. It was kind of chilly. in the nights and in the early mornings and then it warmed up enough to make it pleasant for hiking. There was a lot of kind of hilly, you know, good inclines to hike up and work up a bit of a sweat and then, you know, get a breeze at the top and admire the view. And so we just, we just did a lot of that. And what was really neat about this place was the um the campsite was within a very short distance just a you know 100 yards or so of this spring fed creek which is quite renowned among trout fisher people and the the spring actually bubbles right out of the ground like right there and so we filled our water bottles constantly from the spring and you just sat there in fact at one point I thought it'd be kind of neat to bring the little backpacking stove and put it on a flat rock and we pulled water right out of the spring and I heated it on the camp stove and we made a cup of tea there and kind of laid in the sun and relaxed for a bit and it was just a it was just a really neat restorative experience. We were in this very steep-sided valley and so we got no um, sell coverage. So, you know, it's kind of nice to be hidden away from, you know, the issues in the world these days, or even, even news from watches and wonders for a couple of days and, and just, um, you know, just read books and sit by the fire and drink a little whiskey and go hiking. And, and, uh, yeah, it was, uh, really restorative, really nice and, and kind of a nice way to kick off what I hope will be a really pleasant spring and summer outdoors. So it was great. Very nice, man. Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, I know that there was a fairly major windstorm through the area where my cottage is, so there's a ton of cleanup. Some of my family members have been up and there's no damage, like property damage to speak of, but it'll take like a lot of work to clean up all the branches and everything. So I know that that'll have to start, you know, once we get past Watches and Wonders, it definitely for me starts to become something closer to cottage season. I mean, that's brunted this morning against not inconsiderable snowfall in Toronto, which is just brutal. After five, six days in Geneva where it was borderline, summer on, you know, just too warm for a jacket a couple of the days. But yeah, I'm very much excited to get back up to the cottage and we've got some stuff to work on up there. But seeing you out on that camping trip, I was just like, man, that looks like heaven. And no cell coverage, man, what a dream, right? |
| Jason Heaton | That's all right. Well, it was interesting, too. It gave me an opportunity. And this kind of goes against the whole idea of being disconnected. But when I did check, when I did power up my phone and look at it, It was my first opportunity to try Apple's satellite messaging feature. I don't know if that was an iOS thing or specific to the phone I have. I think I've got a 15. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, I think it's 15 and later. Granted, I could be wrong, but I think it's a 15 and later thing. I've seen the thing pop up before. I've never used it. People of our age, Jason, remember the era when an errant text message could cost $5? Yeah, or like use a little bit of data and in the wrong country and it's $1,000 or something like that. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. I don't know if there was a cost associated with this. I don't think there was. I was, it asked me when I, when I connected to the satellite, it said, do you want to use it to find something like find your laptop, find your AirPods? Yeah. Um, SOS or messaging. And I just selected messaging cause I just wanted to check. you know, all's well with my parents. Um, and with the woman that was taking care of my dog, uh, you know, wanted to see if there were any questions or anything, there weren't any, everything was fine back home. So, you know, I didn't use it really for anything, but it was, it was unique. It was interesting to kind of see how Apple does that. Yeah. Yeah. So. |
| James Stacy | You know, I do think I didn't realize this was a feature because I hadn't clicked into it before I've gotten a little icon on my phone Yeah, sometimes on airplanes that sort of thing But I didn't realize you could use like imagine using a satellite to find your air pods. Yeah, that feels insane, right? It's like kind of almost preposterous just put the drone in the air, you know, get the predator up to find my AirPods. But I had no idea you could check, you know, to find your AirPods, you know, in the middle of a field in the Karakorum or something using a satellite. Pretty cool. Yeah, that's pretty wild. Pretty wild for sure. I'm not sure that's the absolute best use for a satellite, but hey, I love my AirPods as much as anybody else. fair enough yeah but yeah and then uh from my side i've just just uh just watches and wonders really uh you know those those final days before i flew out were exceptionally busy um and that's when the last episode would have gone up and then i spent the week in in geneva and i figure we'll get to most of that stuff uh in the main topic so if you like we can we can dip right into some risk check and then jump into uh the megasode |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, definitely. I'll go first. I pulled out my Rolex Submariner, my 14060M. I haven't worn it a ton, but for whatever reason, maybe it was kind of seeing all the Rolex buzz around watches and wonders that just kind of encouraged me to pull it out and wind it up and wear it. And I've been wearing the CWN1, you know, our CWC collaboration watch so much lately that I've just been so used to just wearing a NATO strap on a watch and something super light. And it just, it hits different to wear, you know, a steel watch on a steel bracelet. And it's, It's not a, not a bad thing, not a good thing. It's just, it just, it feels different. And one thing that's kind of neat about it is that it's just so easy to kind of take on and off, you know, like when you're like going for a run, I switched to my Garmin or if I'm. Oh, for sure. You know, wrenching on the Land Rover, whatever, it just kind of slips off. You tuck it in your pocket or whatever you're going to do. And it's just a, just a different thing than threading a NATO strap in a very small way. But, uh, yeah, that's what I've got on. Nice. How about you? You have something watches and wonders related on your wrist. |
| James Stacy | To a certain extent, I suppose. You know, to Watch the Wonders, I took the CWN1 and I took my Datejust, and those were both perfect. I've really just come to, the longer and more I wear it, just kind of feel like CWN1 is kind of the current headquarters, if you will. The current, you know, touch base scenario, and I've been really liking it, but I got home and got to spend a couple hours with, maybe not even a couple hours, it was probably a little less than that, but with Kenneth from Arkin, and I got home and it just immediately threw on my Altarum, which was very fun. I got to see some of the stuff they have coming up. So I don't love teases, I don't love saying, wait, watch this space or that kind of stuff, but I can't share what Kenneth showed me, but you will find out pretty soon with some kind of special speakeasy sort of releases and that sort of thing. But yeah, so I figure that's probably the easiest way would just be to jump into a chit-chatting about the show and before we get to the watches You've got a question. Here's like kind of what was the scene? What was the vibe? |
| Unknown | Yeah. Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Well, first of all, I have to ask this I have to ask one question because it caught me off guard because I you know I still get press releases sent to my inbox and I actually got the I believe the Rolex press release came in on... Was it Sunday night or Monday night? I can't remember which day it was. But did they release the press stuff early? Did stuff come in early? Were you surprised by that or were you expecting that? |
| James Stacy | If everybody will allow, here's some inside baseball. I'm not sure if other people are talking about it on podcasts. I assume they are, so I'm sure I'm not breaking anything. But if you've ever listened to any of these episodes or any of the Hodinkee Radio, or really anything about how people cover Watches and Wonders in the past, And I would say, if we're saying in the past, I can give you context back to 2012 for Baselworld. And then, obviously, over the course of the pandemic, we sort of blended, if you will, Baselworld and SIHH, and then Swatch does their own thing. But going back to 2012, brands all essentially had a coordinated window for embargoes, and especially the three brands that don't really share stuff in advance, or don't commonly share stuff in advance. So they don't even do embargoes, it's just Rolex, Tudor, and Patek. In the past, I think as much as I can possibly remember, it's always been 8.30am first day of the show. |
| Unknown | Yeah. |
| James Stacy | that's when Patek, Rolex, and Tudor send out their press room stuff and update their websites, right? And this year, we were getting a lot of pre-show emails from other brands that were at the fair saying that they were launching their embargoes at 12.01 a.m. April 1st, Geneva time, which is what, 6 p.m., 6.01 p.m. in New York on March 31st. And so we thought, OK, that that is what it is. Most of these brands, you can write the story beforehand. They send you images and specs and that sort of thing. So, you know, I can't speak for other brands. I'm sure it was very similar. Hodinkee had like about 55 stories prepared to go right whenever we wanted, especially in that first day. And if you're watching the site, it was just every few hours. It was a wave of of new releases. Anyway, so get to Geneva, and there's some local chatter about other brands, again, we're talking Patek, Rolex, Tudor, not doing 12.01. And then other people were saying, oh, they are, but not all of them. And you go, okay. So send some emails. Turns out, yes, Rolex is going at 12.01, Patek is going at 12.01, Tudor's going at 8 a.m. So to those of you who are uninitiated, the way that I've always covered the show, and certainly as now EIC of Hodinkee, I've continued this trend with Hodinkee, is you book a boardroom at the hotel where you're staying. So we normally stay at a hotel in Geneva. You book a boardroom at that hotel. So instead of going to the show and spending the morning of the first day at the show taking meetings, we spend that morning writing about the Rolex Tudor and Patek stories. Yeah. So it's, you know, three or four hours sitting in a boardroom, everybody picking watches, sharing information, you know, working on perspectives and information, you know, executions of various specs and that sort of stuff. And then when when the stories are done and published, we go to the show. And so I had a room booked for that morning, the morning of the first, like, you know, starting from 7 a.m. and going until 1 p.m. or something at the hotel. Then when Rolex shifts or Rolex finally confirms an email, because they don't send anything saying when their embargo is, you had to ask. And when Rolex confirmed it, I go, OK, well, we now have to shift that room. So I shift the room to be in the middle of the night. Like, you know, we have the room from 10 p.m. until 4 a.m. or something like that. in Geneva. And then some of you are seeing the logistical issue, which is I've got nine other colleagues, staff members, team members at the event. I'm going to have them up in the middle of the night, send them home, and then they have to be back up to cover Tudor at 7.30-ish. right so it's kind of a tough way to start the show in terms of like focus and attention and not being too tired we even like we endeavor to try and have people come a day or two earlier so that they're less jet lagged for the show yeah and that sort of thing and this kind of undermines all that so it was not an ideal scenario to launch these watches it would have been great if everybody was either Like from the press standpoint, from somebody in my position, just if everybody was aligned. But then from a brand standpoint, we had lots of brands, we're not thrilled. You know, for brand standpoints, especially if you're not one of these brands that commands all the attention on day one, this is kind of a bummer for you because why would you do a major, hugely expensive trade show where the embargo preempts the doors? Yeah. Yeah. Everything was known before anybody went to the show because it was 1201 and the show didn't open until eight or nine or whenever that I don't, I genuinely don't know when the show starts. I never go for the first minute. It's too busy and we're busy writing the watches. So it was a weird strategy. And, and you know, if I just bored everybody for, for the last 10 minutes, you'd like my sincerest of apologies. But this is like, if you're capturing how the show, the vibe of the show was, this was kind of the first thing. Cause it was like, um, not pandemonium, but nobody knew anything. Yeah. And so you had rumors, you had people saying, I got an email from this person saying that, and somebody else saying, well, there's no possible way that Rolex and Tudor won't go at the same time. And so it's a lot of just sending emails, adjusting bookings of rooms, and this kind of stuff. But we were able to cover everything. And I think it went largely quite well. Tons of video from the Hodinkee standpoint. So if you're If you only caught us on the homepage, but you would like to see more in terms of video and that sort of thing, there's a ton on the Instagram. And it was all very successful. So it was largely like a really good show. And I would say like beyond the embargo thing, I think you could just tell that people really wanted there to be good product at a decent price. And I think we saw a lot of good product. The pricing is difficult. And then just as the show was really kind of developing its own sort of perspective, if you will, like its own personality, the tariff thing happened with this announcement of huge tariffs against Swiss exports by the US. And look, we are not a political podcast at all. In fact, we try and offer this as something of a respite. Everywhere else you go in the world will have political opinions. I think if you've listened to more than just this one episode, you know exactly where Jason and I land on this quality of leadership. I don't think it's something we need to talk about on the show because it's being talked about everywhere else. But it was incredibly disruptive. Oh, well and Just just totally derailed What would have been you know? Kind of the product tone of the show the major all of a sudden by two days two days into the kind of the major four Days there for the press. Yeah, the only thing people wanted to talk about was the tariffs and what it could mean and what CEOs were doing about it. And, and, you know, you definitely talk to brands, you know, I spoke with some smaller brands who, to be clear, didn't want didn't specifically want to say, cite their name, but they said, I could share that this was going on, like sort of, you know, an anonymous thing, you know, like, just a lot of brands that are going, Alright, well, we'll get everything we can to the states ASAP. Wow. And if you zoom out just a little bit, and again, even beyond the politics, we don't really cover the business side of watches that carefully. That's not really TGN's perspective, right? But, you know, I think you have this scenario where like a lot of brands will have to scramble to find ways to sort of guide their way through this because there's so many unknowns. So you had brands saying, oh, well, you know, we have a logistics warehouse in you know, somewhere in the states and we're moving as many watches as we can there as quickly. But it's very difficult to know what happens because of course there's no, it almost feels like this is a weird game of risk where like any dice roll, who knows what the news is going to be like next. Sometimes there's a tariff, sometimes there isn't, sometimes it's a threat, sometimes it's real. So it's just led to this insane. And look, to be clear, for what this did to the global markets, it's much less important to the watch world. None of this is a... But you look at what's going on in the rest of the world. So this is only a part of that, but this is a watch-focused podcast. So I would say those two things were kind of the major non-product-derived feeling from the show, was just there was some chaos from the embargoes and then there was absolute chaos And just a lot of people trying to figure out what anything meant to a certain extent. But who really knows at this point? And certainly not my place. I'm not an economist. I can't play one on the internet. But I would say that would be probably the two major things. And then of course the big stuff. um were some of the you know the the product cycles with things like the land dweller were probably that's and that's probably where you start yeah from uh from a news standpoint it's it's rolex's major release for this year it's an absolutely huge movement evolution and if you haven't read rich's story which goes into all of the comparative movement evolutions and what this means to rolex i'll put it in the show notes i think it's a very complete outlook on more than just this watch looks like an Oysterquartz. Yeah. It provides kind of a broader perspective. But, you know, I think a lot of this, Jason, because you weren't there and you mentioned this just before we started recording, a lot of this is probably going to function like a on paper on wrist, which is a series we used to do where one of us has seen the watch and one of us has seen, you know, the ads, the YouTube videos, the Instagram. Look, I think this is largely outside the scope of TGM to some extent. I think it's a watch that starts at 13,000 Swiss francs, certainly goes up from there. How did this kind of hit you? Something you were interested in or just kind of like, oh, another kind of Rolex with, in this case, quite a revolutionary kind of change in movement structure for them? |
| Jason Heaton | I think for me, the thing, it's kind of typical, typical Rolex in terms of their releases and how they hit me. I'm always slightly disappointed. I don't want to say underwhelmed because this is a very impressive product, but I always feel like they just missed in terms of my own taste. Like there's always just something that's like a little off. for me, like to see some teaser stuff ahead of time showing the integrated bracelet and that shape case, which I love. I mean, I've always loved, you know, there was the Oysterquartz, then they made an automatic date watch called the 1530 reference, I think back in the early seventies that I just always liked that look and always hoped they would bring it back. But then I saw the dial, that kind of honeycomb texture, and the Jubilee bracelet I can live with, it's okay. You know, I would have preferred that kind of flat riff on the Oyster bracelet that we saw in the past. So look, the nostalgic part of me was disappointed, but it certainly piqued my curiosity. And I think it's an impressive watch. the thing I just can't get around and it's this feels so like simplistic to say but the name is just like how did that pass committee how did the name land dweller you know who thought that up and I think maybe there was a historical precedent for that name but it's just it's just so so bad the name in my mind you know and I can't get past that |
| James Stacy | yeah kind of the whole thing kind of strikes me like um and and i don't say this as a dig against rolex i'll finish the point i promise but like it hits me a bit like a concept car where i go like i don't really get the name the name is kind of clunky which is not a word i i would um normally like attribute to rolex yeah but that said the name and the watch might just be so new that we don't like you haven't accepted it yet kind of like concept cars yeah and then once you see them on the road for a while and it kind of fits in i don't really you know the dial doesn't speak to me that said you know compared to a lot of the six digit the common six digit sport models these days it's not as shiny I think it's an interesting looking watch. The mix of the honeycomb dial and the Explorer numerals is quite punchy. In person, it's quite a bit less punchy than you see in some of the images. It feels much more like a Rolex in person. I can't say that I feel super strongly in either direction about the watch. I like the movement quite a bit and what that means for Rolex and the amount of work that goes into developing something like that. But I thought for my taste, certainly, and maybe for the broader TGN vibe, it was kind of a weird year, right? Because we've got new Easter egg OPs, the kind of pastel OPs, and I think those could be interesting to people. They represent a lower price point for the brand. Granted, I don't know what retail will be, or like what real price will be, like landed price. uh for those and then you know i i think i've long said you know my my taste for gmt masters kind of hit its peak at the 16 7 10 uh you know the the five digit and 40 millimeters i love a coke bezel and all that kind of stuff But I will say that the Cerachrom white gold green dial GMT is the best I've felt about a six-digit GMT ever. In steel it would... I mean I'm not a white gold guy, I don't have that kind of money for a watch in general, but you know I think my major complaint or even just not even complaint, the way that I see the the modern stuff is it's quite shiny right when you move to the ceramic bezel we move to more polished surfaces and the engraved riat which i even have on on my 6570 but with this one the the dial isn't it's not just that it's matte it's that it's just less reflective. I wouldn't necessarily call it matte because it's still ceramic, but the dial is this very sort of opaque, solid, even green, and I just really, really liked it in person. It's white gold, it's a fortune, all that kind of stuff. It's not a normal thing that I would be chasing or want to go after, and I already have 16 570 that is perfect yeah so I'm not I'm not in the need for another Rolex GMT but if you're if you want something that simply feels different than the other ones check this one out if you get if you walk into a Rolex store just ask to see it I think the dials kind of surprising it's cool I think Rolex is if I look over the past few years you know I've |
| Jason Heaton | I almost hate to say this and I'm wearing my beloved sub today, but I feel like it's a brand that is moving further away from my tastes and ethos and that isn't necessarily a bad thing. I mean, I guess it's bad for me if I really was feeling a sense of loss, which I don't. I just feel like, fortunately, I feel like Tudor has slipped into that space. I feel like, you know, and we've said it many times before, but Tudor kind of occupies the space that Rolex used to feel for me, like, like this sub on my wrist right now feels like the way, you know, Black Bay or Pelagos did or does. That's kind of what's happened now. And so a lot of the Rolex releases I'm watching from a more disinterested distance as I might with something from Oh, I don't know, you know, AP or, or, you know, something like that. It just, it feels a little bit more removed from, from my core, even the sports models. Um, they've just gotten, you know, shinier, more expensive, a little more Lux. Um, that said, you know, I love that they're kind of still leading the industry and kind of moving in these directions with, with something like the movement to the land dweller. |
| James Stacy | Yeah. And I think you'll be, if you get a chance to see that GMT, I think it'll put a smile on your face. |
| Jason Heaton | It just feels great. Yeah. |
| James Stacy | So kudos to them on that. I didn't even get a chance to try the 36 mil land dweller, so I don't want to weigh in on how it wears. I had a 40 for three minutes at the meeting and the bracelet was five links too big. So I would also say that If you're out there reading about people, writing about the land dweller, take a grain of salt if the bracelet isn't sized. These are initial impressions. This is not what it's like to have one on your wrist that's yours. And again, with an integrated bracelet sport watch, Rolex or otherwise, they make a lot more sense when they're sized. Yeah, uh, they they make no sense at all. You know, it's just it's like a car without wheels or whatever Like it just it doesn't make any sense until like that that last touch is kind of everything Yeah, um to to the the on-wrist appeal of the of the model So i'm still looking forward to seeing a 36 sometime in the future And and seeing how it wears because you know my date justin 36. I absolutely adore. So yeah. Yeah, they just wear so nicely But yeah, I think next up we, you know, we did Rolex. Let's jump into Tudor. Pretty busy year. You know, I think we spoke about the possibility of a white dial pro on the previous episode. So that's kind of exciting. What do you think of the white? Because in person, it's real good. |
| Jason Heaton | Oh, I love it. I really love it. It's, it's, it's a worthy, um, kind of error, you know, as I, as I just mentioned, like Tudor has slipped into where Rolex, um, you know, was for me. And, and I, I see that the whitetail pro is more me than, than the, the current, um, Explorer two. white dial. I just think it's, it's, it's really, really nice. And it changes completely for me. The black dial left me, I don't want to say flat. I liked it. I think it's a cool watch, but the white dial just really amps up. I really love it. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, I think I agree. I mean, I would say neither, because I have the 16570, neither is something that I'm chasing down. But if that weren't a possibility, I could see this being quite appealing. It's still a little on the chunky side. I wouldn't have a problem wearing it, but if you put on a 41 Black Bay and it's too big, I think this is gonna feel largely similar to that. It is a hair smaller. I think it wears, in my case, better on the bracelet, which it just balances the weight on my wrist a little bit better. But man, it is a good-looking thing, and it's so easy to understand. It's the same watch, but you get a white dial. And the white's just successful. It looks good. It takes the light nicely. The yellow GMT hand still looks pretty good on there in that version. So I think they did a nice job with that. The one I was most excited about is the Pelagos Ultra. So, but it's a 43 millimeter Pelagos, thousand meters, sort of has the, I don't know what the terminology will come out, but if we're allowed to use sort of the Rolex spec, you know, it has sort of an oversized handset, you know, more bold bezel design. It is all matte, like the standard 500 meter version. Slightly different coloring where you get this light blue for the Pelagos. That's your your kind of immediate giveaway and then It just has a handful of these like very small Iterations, so it's it's a millimeter wider. I don't think it wears any different than a standard Pelagos again I didn't try it on a size bracelet, but they had the rubber and And I think it wears very, very similarly to the 42, the 500 meter. Um, but this gives you the higher spec, which, you know, for dive watches is a thing, right? The idea that there's that, that spec up, up, up a bump. And I think it makes sense in the world of the Pelagos, the one millimeter On paper, this will matter to some people. I would highly suggest you just try it on in person to see how it hits your wrist. I think it wears quite nicely. It's very similar in thickness to a 500 meter. I think it's 0.17 millimeters. Oh wow, that's it. |
| Jason Heaton | Thicker. Okay. |
| James Stacy | I think instead of 14.3, it's 14.47, something like that. Negligible. On wrist, it's no different. And Jason, I immediately thought of you when I saw it. I thought, oh, this is very Jason because, you know, it's the big, it's the beefy one and you still get the great clasp. Yeah. And they've evolved the clasp to make it visually on the back of the watch a little bit more simple. and so you still get the multiple stage sort of like T-fit, and then you get the spring extension, and then they went an extra step, and I don't think I've seen this before, as I said in the video I did for Hodinkee, they've got loom on the bracelet. I'm not sure I've seen, I'm sure they're not the first ones. There's so many crazy, interesting, fun companies that mess around with loom, but it's maybe the first time a major brand has done this, but the little marker, which isn't even something you need, which is why I think it's so fun to have this loomed, Like there's no value to knowing the position of how much spring you're using or whatever. But man, like I hit it with a camera flash and it just glows. It looks cool. It's a little dot in the bracelet. And it just made me go, man, it just reminded me, just underlined in my mind how much I would pay for that bracelet made for a 39. Oh yeah, yeah. it would just be so fun and i love the 39 bracelet t fits awesome it's very comfortable all that kind of stuff but that's it's the one thing that for me the 500 and now the ultra really has is that is that bracelet yeah um and that clasp is so cool it's so over-engineered it's so it's so um in my opinion like crucial to the establishment of the pelagos as the you know the the term we've used a ton on the show is as like the apex predator of dive watches Yeah, and much like with everything Tudor does now, it's additive. They're not taking anything away. They're not adding the Ultra and removing the 500 meter or the 39 or any of the FXDs. It's additive. So I mean, like, my preference would still be a 39 for sure, simply because ergonomics for me is like right up at the very top. You know, the watch has to wear well for me to want to wear it. But within the vibe of the beefy, them going for the full fat Pelagos, this thing's really cool. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Yeah. I mean, as you said, the clasp is the calling card of this watch in so many ways. And I remember way back when they first introduced the Pelagos, the first one, it was like that was the talking point, and it still is. And they've added this... This fun loom feature, and I will mention the Vertex M60 Aqualine has loom on its clasp, and it shows when you flip. Oh, I totally didn't remember that. When you flip up the safety latch, I guess, you know, flip block, whatever you want to call it, it tells you if that's open because there's two dots that glow. Okay. Well, there you go. |
| James Stacy | Kudos to Vertex out there first. I love it. |
| Jason Heaton | That's great. But I do like this watch. I love the fatter hands. I think it's cool. The matched lume, the different lume on the hands, the light blue for the word Pelagos separates it. And then it still has all the great stuff about the standard Pelagos. I guess in my mind, I was wondering like, Why not just like up spec the 500 like it's so close it's like they've doubled the water resistance and added like they've improved it why not just make a you know 2.0 instead of a whole other skew that's just a millimeter you know just these these tweaks. |
| James Stacy | I guess I'm... That's a fair question. Yeah. Why not just make the 500 a 1,000? Like product lines. |
| Jason Heaton | I always feel like, why not just improve it and tout that aspect of it rather than a whole new skew? And I'm sure there's strategy to it. I'm sure maybe there's someone with a 500 that now wants the 1,000 or whatever. I don't know. But it's... These are all decisions made by people smarter than me, but I just look at this and I think, if this is the top of the line, why not just bump up the 500 and call it 2.0 or new and improved or something like that? But regardless, cool watch. I mean, just a cool, cool watch. |
| James Stacy | Yeah. And then we've got the the nude full red full burgundy up to you. Yeah. I found this to be very shiny in person, which I think will mean that it offers a different appeal than most of the current 58. Yeah. So that's very smart. Not really in my in my milieu, the kind of very rich iridescent red. if i was going red we'll get to a different red later in in these list of watches that i found to be much more successful but look this is a watch people are excited about for sure and it's another color which is you know important to the the way that the strategy kind of works for the black bay so that's in there too and then they had the black bay 68 which I did not see in person, so I don't want to comment on too much. You know, I did speak very briefly with somebody at Tudor about it, a leader at Tudor about it, and they said, like, yeah, I mean, do we need, like, does the Black Bay need to be multiple sizes? The answer is we have customers coming in wanting more of that Breitling sort of feeling. And this is the response to that. So I would say that what we're experiencing is Tudor realizing that they've gone to a certain extent as far as they not as far as they can go, but they have the base down for the enthusiasts. Yeah, they have the the smaller version of the 54. They have the now very successful 39 and 41 millimeter versions. And now we have the black base 68 and 43. And you know, I certainly saw them on people's wrists. They look a lot like a Black Bay. And if you're in the world where your preference is a slightly larger watch, I think this makes sense. I think it's almost like we're seeing Tudor's playbook match up in weirdly like Lincoln phase out of chance with Orisa's, where yeah of course we'll make something at 40 and 39 and maybe even smaller but but the whether it's the aquas or the black bay and it also needs to be available in these larger sizes because there's a certain audience member maybe not the audience member that's um you know pouring over the latest from every brand on on all the blogs yeah but there's definitely people out there who want the larger watches this is why we see bigger numbers from omega and why we see bigger numbers from lots of other brands so It's predictable, personally not something I would say I'm interested in, but it makes sense for them. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, and just my one thought about the Black Bay 68, you know, I'm indifferent about the size, 43 is fine, but what I do like is the blue dial with the black bezel. I think that's a neat color combo. Yeah, oh, it looks good, for sure. It's a good color way. |
| James Stacy | Later in the week, I was able to catch up with Doxa. I think, you know, we talked about this watch when it came out, and it's one I wanted to see in person. And I think seeing it in person was quite interesting. So this is the 250T GMT. We talked about it a bunch, so I don't think we need to spend a ton of time on this. i really like it i like like a lot weirdly the one i liked the least when in the previous recording that we did was the um shark hunter vintage yeah and in person it's an it's awesome like just really really good looking watch not that brown at all it has a warmth to the the gray black gradient yeah but the tan lume, the full white hands and marker set, it's just a really, really successful model. And I think that's one definitely worth trying to see in person, or I'll put up the best possible photos I can and a little hands-on in the next couple of weeks for that watch. But I think all the specs were quite successful. I do think that the big minute hand being the GMT hand is weird, but in person, it didn't bother me. I actually found it kind of quirky and delightful. And then I've been going over the photos and that's kind of where I've landed with it. It was cool to see it next to the full size, the 750T. Because it's so much smaller. And I have photos of them next to each other, which I'll share again in that eventual story. But it's so much smaller. and yeah i think if you're if you if you like the sizing look if you prefer the sizing of a 300 it might actually feel a little small but if you like the 200 or or you don't mind to watch in the 40 millimeter range again docks is where a little smaller than the number suggests because the dials are quite small yeah and the cases are quite square but i i think this is a winner and i think at the price point It's a little punchy for if your mind, kind of like mine, is kind of set in 2018, 2017 prices from DOXA. But the world has moved on to a certain extent. And I think at less than $1,000 or about $1,000, I guess, once the exchange is done from a 200 to add the GMT, it doesn't bother me. I don't think it's overpriced. I think this is just kind of what these things sort of cost. And it still costs less than a standard 300. which I think is sort of the remarkable element. Yeah. |
| Unknown | Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. I won't add much to what you said because I think we discussed it on the last one, but yeah, for sure that Shark Hunter Vintage is the one that speaks to me and I look forward to seeing one of those in person. Very, very neat watch. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, I'm pumped by it. They showed some of the stuff that's coming up later in the year and over the next year. If your Doc's a fan in the audience, they've got a whole run coming. There's some interesting stuff. I think there's lots to be excited about. So if you're hoping for more than the 250T GMT, then I would say just hang on to your butts and wait for more from them because they've got more for sure. |
| Jason Heaton | Where would you like to go next? I got to hear about Bremont because I was curious. I didn't see a ton about their new watches online other than they really were kind of going full on with their kind of social media blitzes with the campaign around the new Altitude collection. The MB looked promising. I remember when I visited the UK last year and talked to Bremont and they were kind of introducing all these new lines and new changes. I thought, I remember saying like, don't mess with the MB. That is the watch you cannot mess with. And it seems like they did okay with it. I mean, it looks pretty darn good. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, look, I've been critical of Bremont over the last couple of years, certainly over the, we'll call it the last year, since the sort of ownership and that scenario sort of changed. And I agree that if there was a big risk, something that you really don't wanna change, it's the MB. And I actually, I have to be fair here, I took in the whole presentation. I think they did a nice job of evolving something. They kind of had two options. You could stop making the MB, the way that it was, it didn't fit into their structure, it didn't fit into the new plans for the brand, they could run it down and be done with it, but it is something kind of major for the brand. I think they actually took kind of a thoughtful approach and one that feels almost antithetical to last year's approach, where this feels like a direct evolution of a bunch of things from Bremont back into the, what is now going to be called the altitude collection. The Altitude Meteor is your new MB2. It's now titanium, it's now a millimeter smaller, and it wears two millimeters, maybe three millimeters smaller. It's a little shorter lug-to-lug, it's lighter, it's thinner, and the bracelet's quite nice. Just trying to be as fair as possible. Nothing about this watch bothered me, and it felt like a Braymont. I feel like that's fairly high praise, considering what we talked about from their releases last year. and then they've essentially taken the same format and applied it to something more like the Solo in a 39mm time and date version. Really nice in person. Significantly nicer than the Solo I had in terms of proportions and dial finish. They've got, I think, these sort of interesting sort of design for the numerals that are, you know, kind of designed to replicate like a stencil on the side of like a box or something like that, but they're applied and they're running, I believe, movements from Le Jouperie, so the G100-based movement, so you're getting better specs, better power reserves, all that kind of stuff. And then if you want, there's also a chronograph, which is a bit like crossing... Man, if you're not in the Bremont world, we're really speaking French here, or some language you don't know. Apologies to the French speakers. I know only a bit, so that was the example that I used. But you really have to speak in terms of the brand's lingo, if you will. And then if you imagine like an Alt-1 ZT, a watch that I adored, but it was always pretty big. They've made that a little bit thinner, a little bit smaller, and combined it into the same vibe as the MB, and that's in 904 steel. I think that this is the only way you could approach this and make it work. You either keep making the thing that was already being made or you could evolve it. But this evolution feels like they looked back at the catalog and picked a few notes, a few songs that worked, if you will, and blended it into a remix. And I really kind of impressed by all of it. The pricing still feels a little high in today's market. but I think it is more correct than a year ago pricing. So you're starting at about 4,200 British pounds for the core. The absolute line for the altitude starts at 3,950 for the 39 millimeter date model. And if anything, and look, if you're critical of Bremont, I get that, that's fine. They've had some huge changes in the last little while, and I didn't even really see the other watches. This is the watch that I went in and really wanted to see was what they did with it. this core is worth going to the store and seeing. I think you'll be impressed by it. And I think in the transition we saw last year, that gave them the ability to evolve something like the classic, and I'm glad that they took a year to understand the market a bit and then do it. Does any of this hit you as that crazy or out of the box? |
| Jason Heaton | No, I think the one I was really zeroed in on was the MB and I just had a couple of questions about it and one is... Yeah, which is now called the Altitude Meteor. Yeah. I think they didn't want MB was too close to other brands. Well, on the website it says Altitude MB Meteor and I guess that raises the question in my mind of like... Is there still a partnership with Martin Baker, is one question, because they still show the MB2 and MB3 on their website. And then there was some confusing language in the press release that I saw around this watch that the the movement is still retains its magnetic protection via the concept of a Faraday cage, even though the case back is open. And I thought that doesn't ring right for me. That doesn't sit well. Like I was like, how is that even possible to have a Faraday cage? But I mean, these are all minor points that could be answered with an email to their PR folks. But yeah, I was just curious about the MB connection. But in terms of the watch itself, really cool that they added a bracelet to the MB and it's a good looking bracelet and also it is yeah titanium like you know I still have my 43 millimeter white dial MB2 which I love but it's a big heavy watch and so I don't wear it a ton I think in titanium and with this bracelet it could be a really compelling comfortable watch so Yeah, very cool. And the 39 date's nice. It's a little bland for my taste. I think the chronograph is sharp. It's like a solo. Yeah, for sure. |
| James Stacy | The chronograph with the GMT is pretty nice. I agree. If you took all the MBs and put them in a line, this one would feel like an entirely different generation, but it wouldn't feel like it wasn't part of the same family. And, you know, they said it still passes the same tests as the MBs always have and that sort of thing. I don't know about the specific partnership with with Martin Baker, that's certainly a good question. But I think whereas with some of the stuff that came out last year, and certainly in terms of general coverage of Bremont, I was kind of in an ignore phase or a, you know, let's see where this goes. And if this is where this is going, I feel better about it. um for sure yeah like i just think this is a successful sports watch with a quick release bracelet a nice finishing uh a realistic price point for for within the context of how braymont's always operated they were never the brand you were buying because they were the cheapest for what you were getting yeah But there's no world in which in my mind this doesn't stack up next to an IWC in most phases Especially now that we've got a 70-hour Movement like obviously with IWC you're gonna pay more but you might get in-house and that sort of thing definitely it's some changes but less change I would think in last year and The bracelet I think really really does a lot to bring the line into a new level Yeah, yeah |
| Jason Heaton | Well, you mentioned IWC. Let's move because it's kind of a logical move, I guess, or at least IWC of old. But I do think that the new Ingenieur was kind of the talk of, I suppose, their launch this year, right? What do you think? It's a small one, 35. Wow. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, so of the watches that they released, this one just melts on your wrist. The full-size 40 Engineer wears bigger than 40, if I can, if that makes any sense. Try it on your wrist, of course. I think it's quite a large watch, given its size, and that's an integrated bracelet thing, and the size of the dial, the lack of the, you know, it's a sterile bezel sort of setup, that sort of scenario. But these 35s, I gravitated to them immediately. They're about $10,000 is where they start. And it uses a Val-Fleurier movement, which is, you know, saves you a couple grand, but also allows, I think, for the smaller case size. That may bother some people. For those of you who don't know, Val-Fleurier is essentially Richemont's watchmaker or movement maker. So could you call it in-house? Maybe as much as a Panerai or maybe not as much as a JLC. It's up to you how you want to We're not in-house guys. Yeah, this isn't something that I want. Does the movement work really well? And how often do I need to bother getting it serviced? And I think Valfleri has a fairly good reputation on those fronts. I'm less worried about, you know, the movement in a time and date watch. Like, we're not asking that much from it. But for $10,000, I mean, the watch feels really good and looks really good. And $35,000, I would say it wears like if you enjoy Let's call it that range of like a 36 millimeter, a Datejust, that sort of thing, a Hamilton Khaki in the smaller sizing. I think you'll like the way this hits your wrist. I really liked it. It's a good looking watch. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, it is good looking. |
| James Stacy | I don't spend that kind of money on watches, to be clear. And if I was buying an IWC, I'd probably buy you know, one of the smaller Pilot's watches. I think they're just so beautiful and cool. But if you're really into the fixed bracelet sort of Ingenieur vibe, I think these are quite successful. |
| Jason Heaton | What do you think? Yeah, I do like it. I do like the Ingenieur and I feel like it might be, well, with the exception of the Pilot collection, it kind of still has a toehold in the IWC of old or the IWC, at least the aesthetics that I Kind of long for that. I still wish existed. You know, I just it's it's one of those brands that You know, I mentioned earlier that Rolex has kind of moved out of my core space and my general ethos or taste and I just I remember back when I did, you know when I was just getting into watches and IWC was so aspirational in such a tool watch way that it was just I just long for that I long for You know, in those early days, those first few years of SIHH when I was going and they would, every year was a themed year and it was a pilot year. It was a Portuguese year. It was an Aqua timer year. Um, I miss those days. Um, IWC has changed a lot, but I, you know, in terms of a specific watch, I think this one, this one looks great. And 35 is a, is a gutsy move. I mean, that's a, that's a quite a small size and, and, but it seems to work. I like it. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, for sure. I agree. I I think it's good stuff. You know, they have this very strong Year ahead because of the f1 movie. Oh, yeah Um, and and certainly like we're recording this on a tuesday and on thursday night. I go to the uk for one day uh, so if you happen to be at uh, Goodwood members meet this weekend this coming weekend. See if you can find me. Please say hi. I would love to say hi I'll be kicking around for one day and then going home This is a big year for IWC, but it's automotive based. And Jason, I think you and I just want them to do... I'm so excited to see what the next gen of the AquaTimer is. Yeah, yeah, same. I don't have a problem with what they make now. I just want the next thing. I want stuff in the, you know, in the 38 to 41 space. I would love to see them go... 2026 is the year GST comes back. yeah yeah and and just like really show people how they can make cool interesting sometimes fairly colorful sports watches and go all like why don't we have a deep four yeah right yeah the world could like let's have some fun with this yeah i think that they're they have such a solid line you can buy great pilots watches. You can now buy a variety of great integrated bracelets. If you want QPs, they've got that. I'm excited. Hopefully in the next couple of years, we see like IWC go back to the AquaTimer in a manner that reflects, let's call it 2000 to 2007. It was just such a fun time and some really interesting watches came out of there. And I mean, those watches were so interesting. They bled into Porsche design and other stuff where we just, we saw things that not other brands were really attacking. And so that would be my kind of note, but I'm definitely excited for more stuff to come out of the F1 movie. And certainly, you know, stay tuned to Hodinkee for some coverage of what that's like at Goodwood. They're doing some sort of a, you know, promotional event at the show. Or, you know, at the Goodwood event itself. |
| Jason Heaton | I think in a similar vein, we should switch over to Zinn, which you probably saw at Time to Watches, kind of the adjacent show. I sure did. Because they occupy that space that IWC kind of moved out of, in my mind. What did you see there? Anything new? I guess it was more hands-on for watches that we have talked about in the past. |
| James Stacy | So we talked about the bubble, what we'll call the bubble divers, the U-15, 16 and 18, really, really nice in person. The bubble effect is in the dark, is quite dark and in sunlight is very punchy. So it's a full, you get the full spectrum. So if that appeals to you, I think that the appeal is even stronger now that I've seen it in person. I think I would still lean on a T-50. myself or a U50, like a more standardized model. The UX in the 50 sizing is so cool. So they have a lot to offer in that space. But I gotta say the one that really got to me was seeing that 613STUTC in person. It's basically perfect zen. It's a little chunky, like in the same way that a 41 millimeter Black Bay is, but the bracelet, They've got the bracelet to a certain level. The spec is very cool. And then it's a cool story because the movement is a module that they designed or a modification to a Salida movement that they designed to allow for the GMT hand, which is not the local hand, it's a flyer style GMT, but allow it to jump rather than kind of slop between the movements. which is more common with the 7750 derived, you know, GMTs like like I had in my 144 ST. Yeah. And so here you're getting the chronograph and you're getting an updated movement and the movement engineering is so strong that they're working with Solita to make this will be a movement that other people can access, that the brand is going to produce, and that also help them to keep the price quite a bit lower. So again, we just talked about time-only Bramonts and the $4,000 price paid, lots of stuff in $4,000 to $6,000 from Tudor that is time and date, right? And here we're looking at an automatic UTC chronograph with an in-house customized movement, and it's $3,800 on a bracelet. |
| Jason Heaton | Amazing. |
| James Stacy | I just think if you like the idea of a multifunctional Zen, I really, really like this watch. Huge win for them. Yeah. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying anyone in the audience or you or I, Jason, need to spend $2,400 on a watch at all. But if you're already into this space, if you're listening to a now hour plus long, we're gonna go for a little while here, pod about these watches, that's probably not an insane price, or at least that's how it hits me. I still like my $100 Timexs and $1,000 Microbrands and that sort of thing, but that just feels like a lot of watch if you want a Zen chronograph. in today's market, because if you want a Tudor chronograph or a Longines chronograph, you're spending a lot more. You just are to a certain extent, depending on the watch. Is it worth it to go all the way up to the UTC? It would be for me. I would sell a watch. I would save up or whatever and figure it out. I really like this watch. The coloring's just right. It wears really well. Yeah, I'm impressed by it wall-to-wall. Wood buy, wood own, for sure. It's probably top of my list these days for Xero. Yeah, it's cool. And one of two GMTs that I'm looking around thinking, we'll get to the other one soon, but then I'm looking around going like, what should I sell to cover this? Which is good some couple of good product. Yeah sneaky, but good. Yeah. Yeah, Zinn had it for sure and then let's not forget the one that I hadn't seen because I didn't pay attention to the press release because they're marketing it as a ladies watch Men could easily wear this watch. It's called the 534. It's super cool in person so either white mother of pearl or dark mother of pearl but both are very subtle it's not that like super flashy mother of pearl that's like a zen vibe yeah so the case size is 34 millimeters it wears nice and small it's very thin and then they have this faceted finish on the bezel that i've simply never seen before And weirdly, it's both kind of resplendent and fancy, but super industrial. I don't really know how they did it. It looks very cool. They said it's exceptionally difficult. I see that. To get that to work on the bezel, but I've never quite seen that finish before. And it really makes it feel dressy, but not in a way that isn't a zen. It's a neat little thing that they kind of, the execution really, they nailed on this. I think this is a good watch. |
| Jason Heaton | They call it rhombus-shaped faceting, and it kind of has this scalloped, like if you picture the Omega Seamaster bezel done a little bit smaller, but yeah, like in a more repetition of it. Yeah, the Dark Mother of Pearl is cool, and on a strap, I think it would be great. Yeah, that's how I tried it. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, yeah, very cool, yeah. And any of these hit you really strongly? I could kind of see like a 613 being in your vibe, the GMT and the Chrono, the do-it-all. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, I'm, I'm still more of a kind of a u50 t50 guy. I think that that kind of more simplified Zinn diver, um, you know, even with like a black bezel, I think is more my taste when it comes to Zinn or even these, these, these bubble, you know, you series ones, I think. Um, but I have to admire the pricing, you know, you were talking earlier about the, you know, the docks of GMT being, you know, roughly in the same, kind of price area almost identical actually to the chronograph the Zen chronograph here and You know, it's like Zen is just always so competitive at the pricing they offer so much I mean you get like the you know, the argon You know capsule the dehumidifying stuff the high magnetic resistance the captive bezel. I mean they just throw everything in these watches and then You know, they're made from you know, German steel and and you know this movement innovation. It's it's just you It brings to brings to mind this question of like why don't I have a Zinn in my collection anymore? You know, it's been many years They're just so great when I'm lamenting that IWC isn't making the kinds of watches I used to love like Zinn still is. Yeah. |
| James Stacy | Yeah. Yeah. No big big kudos to Zinn It was a really nice meeting. They're also the time to watch has moved to a new space So it was in like this cool old house right by the Pal Expo. Oh nice big old house And so there was natural light. |
| Unknown | So the photos are awesome. |
| James Stacy | It wasn't this, you know, black room with a black ceiling, you know, kind of warehouse vibe. I mean, the school, the design school where they did it previously was fine, but it was difficult to get a photo. And it was really nice to be in there and to see these. And yeah, just, you know, the appeal for me of the 144 has never really gone away. I never should have sold it. and this definitely scratches that itch. So I'm excited to see kind of what the secondhand price is on these, because it's a Zen, it's going to last forever. I can be patient. That could be a very interesting one. And that 534, add that to the list of, Jason, how many times a year do we get like, hey, I'd like to buy a watch for my partner, small wrist, my daughter, I don't like watches over 36 millimeters, what should I buy that's still kind of interesting? And so that can be added to the list for sure. I love that, I've talked about it a ton on the show, that Seiko SACM 150 Dolce, that like 34 millimeter super thin quartz dress watch I have, and this I think hits like a very similar sort of thing where you still get a brand you love seeing Seiko, that sort of thing, but it's like it's a whole different vibe than a U-series diver or something. |
| Jason Heaton | Well, before we leave time to watches, there's one more brand in here that you visited, and that's Marathon. Tell me about the white dial Osar. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, the Osar D in white, and they had my number, man. White dial, black markers, really good lume. This is, I also, I realized that as I put the watch on my wrist, especially on the rubber, you know, mid-size, their 41 millimeter case is probably my favorite chunky watch in the world. Because is it really tall? Absolutely. Does it have that wild, what's the term, castellated bezel, that term that you use? Absolutely does. Is the crown big and very easy? Yeah, of course, it's great. But as soon as you put it on your wrist, you're like, oh no, I kind of get like, it just works. They're so wearable. It looks so good in white with that splash of red from the depth rating and the seconds hand. And yeah, I just think super successful. Obviously, people went nuts for this watch in the black version. That's what we saw at the Toronto Timepiece Show last year. And I think the white is just a complete win at $1,500 USD. I just think it's a lot of watch. it's still super tool-ish. You can go down a size if you want something smaller. They have it in the either a 36 mil case. Wow. And the weird thing is, is because the meat and they have the full size, the big one, the J. Yeah. But the medium size one almost feels, it makes the small one feel very small to have them all three in front of you. So it's kind of an interesting thing, but I really like it. They did a nice job with it, for sure. Yeah, this is gorgeous. Yeah, I could see this being up your alley too. You've got a couple marathons already, but yeah, this is a winner. And I just love a white dial with the black outlines on the markers, like my 16570, like the Arken that I've got on now. And I just, I think this works really well. It looks good. Pricing makes sense. yeah automatic you know very nicely made swiss watch uh you know with with a cool kind of military government connection for 1500 bucks yeah such such core tgn it's so so cool to see them coming out with this stuff for sure yeah that one was great and the other thing i saw at time to watch is that i don't want to miss a chance to talk about and i have to offer a big thank you to asher rafkin of collective who's been on the show before and a big supporter of tgn he and gabe And I absolutely had to borrow it. So I had it on my wrist for three or four minutes. And dude, I love this thing. |
| Jason Heaton | Oh, yeah. |
| James Stacy | It's totally ridiculous. Doesn't really fit my wrist that well. It's perfectly comfortable because there's almost no lugs. Yeah. But it's so comfortable. It's so comfortable. It's so comfortable. But you'd swear you were strapping on a piece of dive equipment from an alternate reality where like circuit boards were never designed or something. I'm not really sure what world where this would be modern, but it feels like an insane piece of dive equipment. And then it's just it was so much fun to see it in person. So a huge thank you to Asher and a huge shout out to Singer. That thing is awesome. It should be. It's a fortune, and it's barely a watch, but it's so cool. That's really cool stuff. |
| Jason Heaton | And were they at Time to Watches? Or no, they're probably in that hotel. |
| James Stacy | I believe Singer was at the Beau Ravage. But yeah, I just wanted to get that out there because it was like a highlight of my four or five days in Geneva, was getting to see this in person. I missed it last year, and Asher already knew I would be super excited when he showed it to me, and then I got a couple of photos. It'll be on my Instagram in the next couple of days once I get around to posting like the 60 or 70 images I have in my phone. But man, it's it's really cool. |
| Jason Heaton | Really, really cool. Well, let's jump back over to the Pell Expo because we have two more brands to cover here. And in this one, you want to jump in and let's do tag the big the big boy here and the big news, the new Formula One. I like it a lot. |
| James Stacy | Me too. Normally I'm on everybody's side when it comes to like this feels too expensive. I would just don't let the the fact that moon swatches and and Blancpain swatches exist. Yeah. Don't let that sway you from the idea that that this is actually tag making something really fun and accessible at the entry point of their product level. And they've made something that I think is quite good. I think in the world we live in right now, it doesn't feel out of step with an Aquaracer. So at $19.50 on a bracelet, is it quite a bit more than a Moonswatch? Yeah, of course. It doesn't even feel remotely like the same level of watch. you're getting the solar movement, you get a great bracelet. I was just deeply, deeply impressed and found a huge amount of appeal in that in the steel with the white creamy dial with the red accents. Yeah, I saw a couple models around and like I get that people go like, you know, post moonswatch post all that kind of stuff like oh, why isn't this $500? but also like you can, you can look back. We published a hooding. He published a huge history from Jeff Stein of the Formula One that I think some people miss just because everything was so busy just but that went up the Friday before the fair and it walks you through the fact that they weren't trying to make a watch that was like a souvenir or something to be thrown away after the battery, it's a real watch that's meant to be serviced and cared for and live up to back in its original spec was actually to keep up with surfers and take on that market. And look, I think the watch makes sense, and this is a price point that I believe Tag Heuer has to dominate at. So I don't have a problem with this price point. Obviously, if you don't like the watch, you may not like the price for sure, but I don't think it's fair to say that Tag Heuer needed a moonswatch competitor, but at the same time you don't hold them to the same level as Swatch. Like Omega didn't just make a $300 watch out of bioceramic or whatever. They partnered with somebody that makes $300 watches. and and this is this feel for me is is a very different sort of thing and i like the watch quite a bit i would buy one yeah um that's how much i like it was definitely in my several of my favorites from the show yeah um i'm definitely there's a couple of gmts like the 613 that i'm more dialed on And I think the 613 really paints some, you know, for $400 more, you can have a chronograph, an automatic chronograph from Zen for $2,400. That's good value. I don't know that the F1 or the Formula One is like screaming value, but I think if you look at the catalog from Heuer, it's one of the ones I like the most, and it's right at the base of their entry level. Yeah. |
| Jason Heaton | What colorway do you dig? Well, as you were talking, I'm scrolling through. The ones that speak to me are actually the ones with the retro rubber strap. I mean, that's what I remember. I mean, it's pure nostalgia. I mean, they make this one that's got the kind of a more conventional rubber strap that's got sort of those striations, you know, longitudinal striations. |
| James Stacy | I like the one with the big tag logo in the strap. |
| Jason Heaton | That's exactly what I want. But I can't find a colorway in those that I want. Like, none of the colorways hit me perfectly. Originally I'm like okay the red and the black but like the red case is a bit much I would love that with a different case but regardless that's the strap I want because I just remember those watches from the 80s and I just think they're just they're just so cool I mean the bracelet's cool but like Bracelet watches are everywhere like that that strap is iconic the strap was as much yet part of the identity of this watch as anything else is the bezel and I really like these 1800s a little steep for that, but it is a watch that would last and um Yeah, these are really cool. I was thrilled to see these come back. |
| James Stacy | I think the other thing, and this is to be quite fair, a fair point from the greater watch audience, and certainly some of the feedback I've seen on Slack and that sort of thing, is that these watches are sort of positioned as being in the same emotional range as a Moon's watch. But then the price is different. So like I can understand saying like, well, I don't know about 1900 bucks or whatever. And like, sure, fine. That's this is another one. I'm interested to see like what's the real price. Like if you walk into a retailer, can you get a sale on them in a year? Yeah. And what's the secondhand price? The secondhand price, like does it fall well into the zone of of, you know, a Seiko or something like that? Because then, you know, I think there's quite a bit of appeal there. But I think, you know, it's a it's a new sort of thing for them. This is also we no longer don't crack under pressure. It's designed to win. It's like a brand new tag in the connection to Formula One and that sort of thing. So I think it should be an interesting platform for them. And obviously, for those of you who aren't aware, tag is owned by LVMH. LVMH is now the official timing partner for Formula One, something they took from Rolex starting this year. And that will inform a lot of how this brand operates, certainly within this lineup, the Formula One line, but beyond that as well. So it'll be interesting to see how, if they feel the model's successful at its price point, because that'll be up to the audience, not up to us or TAG for certain, right? People have to buy it for them to, well, talk about a stupid sentence, people have to buy it for them to sell it, right? Uh, so yeah, I think it'll be an interesting thing to watch, but none of it really bothers me once I saw the product. Um, when, when I originally saw some of the leaks or renders of the plastic one and I thought like, Oh, plastic quarts. Yeah, that should be, that should be, uh, you know, three figures. Um, and then once seeing it in person, the solar courts, that sort of thing, it doesn't really bother me. I don't, I don't think it's like a screaming deal, like I said, uh, but the pricing doesn't bother me. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, cool release. Yeah. I mean, you know, going down this list, this felt like almost a better year than last year in terms of stuff. I think there's more for us. Yeah, definitely. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, for sure. And then look, the last one, and this is probably, I've saved the best for last in terms of stuff that I saw that I'm allowed to talk about. that now I'm like looking around trying to figure out what to flip, like what it would replace. Dude, this Nomos Club Sport Neomatic World Timer is so rad. |
| Jason Heaton | So rad. |
| James Stacy | It's beautiful. It's just gorgeous. Yeah. So two standard colors, six limited edition colors, If you want the details, the one that I'm most interested in and I'm absolutely considering figuring out, like I said, how it fits into sort of my, you know, stable of watches these days would be the Glacier, which is like a light blue with a sort of tan coloring, with a little bit of red. I like it a lot. Volcano is quite good. And then from the standard, both of the two standard models, I like a lot. And this is basically them taking a similar sort of functionality of the Zurich Weizeit, their other World Timer. And again, we use World Timer incorrectly because it's part of the branding. I'm a purist when it comes to all these things and I think the terminology matters. World Timer is a watch that shows you all 24 hour, 24 full hour time zones or more. So there's something like 37 time zones. You have brands like the Glashutte Original Cosmopolite and Vacheron Constantin that will offer watches that can show you all 37. The traditional world timer, like a Louis Cartier-based world timer is 24. Other brands will use world timer for, and this includes Nomos, and it doesn't bother me, but just for clarity's sake, it doesn't show you all 24 full hour time zones. It's essentially a GMT with a city ring, and it's quite clever in the way that it's operated. So it's very reasonable in terms of its sizing and thickness. So it's 40 millimeters wide, 9.9 millimeters thick, and 48 millimeters lug to lug. And essentially it looks a lot like a club, which is a watch I've been interested in since they came out. And I do really like them. And then you have sub-seconds at six, and then you have a 24-hour essentially home time on a little dial at three. And then the entire dial is surrounded by 24 cities. So you get a city ring there. The coordinated city is at noon, at 12 on the dial, and it has a little red underline. And basically you link up the two hands so that the both of the time displays, the main time display and the 24 hour time display, are showing the same time. And then you can jump set the main time display, the big hands, using the button on the side of the case. And you're just updating it to the correct city, and there's your two times. I messed around with it on four or five different watches that were all set differently, and within 30 seconds on any one, I was able to re-sync them. Not difficult, fairly straightforward. The other thing that I will shout out is this is a new movement for Nomos as well, and they've done a really nice job on the action of that GMT button. If you've ever owned other watches that have that push button GMT jump, I think many of you will recognize sometimes the first three or four presses are quite crisp, then it gets a little softer. This, I just sat there and you could go all the way around the dial. It feels really good, feels really strong. I love all the different colorways. Like I said, there's a ton of different colorways. And this is where, you know, if you're more in the zone of like wanting red, well, they've got a red I've never really seen on a watch before. It's this sort of, desaturated purple toned red that's quite nice. I think they just did a lovely job with these. They're on a bracelet if you want it. I found the strap, the sort of ahoy style strap better on my wrist, but again the bracelets weren't sized, which you really can't assess a bracelet without having it sized. But this is this is probably my favorite watch of the show Wow I just really really like it. I love being excited about a brand like no most I've wanted one for a decade and could never just decide Between one or the other and don't get me wrong. These are a little on the expensive side for their lineup 47 50 47 20 USD so it's not an inexpensive watch but for some for one where I felt like a real reaction to it and some some real joy and And, you know, Nomos is a company with such limited baggage. You either like the design sort of language or you don't. And I just think this absolutely nails it. It captures the fun side of Nomos in the club, but I get a really cool complication that I would actually use, and it's the right size. Nice and thin. You could put a bunch of different straps on it. I could travel with this without getting any weird attention. |
| Jason Heaton | I'm a fan highly recommend if you could if you've got a chance to see Nomos in person go put this on your wrist it's a it's a cool watch yeah it's it's gorgeous and they do such a nice job with with color um you know I was looking at the kind of the limited edition color ways um I mean even just the yeah which ones which ones did you like well there's there's 175 of each of the other colors so it's pretty limited There's like one with kind of a mustard dial that I like. I don't know that. Dune. Dune. Yeah. Like neat. I'm not sure long term, like that would be the most versatile choice of the standard ones. I think just this this sunburst silver with the blue ring. It's really gorgeous. Just absolutely gorgeous. Does it bother you that there's no date on this? |
| James Stacy | Not even a bit. It's super weird to have a travel watch without a date, but not having to manage it is nice. Yeah. |
| Unknown | Yeah. |
| James Stacy | doesn't bother me at all. I love the idea that I would just have my home time on the sub-dial and you get on and just click and get to enjoy... You get to enjoy the vibe of a world timer, like interfacing with the cities rather than just unscrewing a crown. So it has that travel-y sort of feature for it. but I also think it has, it's almost like someone from Nomos was a bit of a flight master fan. You know, the 24 hour dials have a horizon, you know, bifurcation. They've got a little bit of extra color. I think they just had a lot of fun with these. And I think a lot of times, especially the sort of watches, Jason, that you and I really gravitate towards aren't necessarily fun. Sometimes they are. Sometimes they're kind of serious, especially when you get into travel stuff. And I think these are great. There's Volcano. no clue why this is called volcano it's dark gray with sort of a red blue coloring yeah there's jungle which is a few different greens with a bit of light blue in this in the small dial uh there's canyon which is like orangey browns glacier which is blue and this sort of interesting red that i mentioned uh in the sub dial and then sort of like a tan sort of color to the city ring, which I really do like quite a bit. And then Magma is this dark sort of reddish color, which is great. And then the one that you mentioned, Jason, is Dune, which is sort of a sandy yellow with a bit of orange and light blue. I think these are great. They're not cheap. They would be, you know, a premium sort of watch, certainly in my world, the sort of stuff that I buy. But you can't deny the way that something makes you feel. And I got a no most buzz from these that I haven't had in five or six years. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, they showed some promise last year when they displayed all those tangente colors and they just, they do such a great presentation. I just, I love the vibe of the company. I love the people. I love the design language, not of every watch, but like this one really speaks to me. And now that I'm looking at the other colorways too, I think the glacier is, um, might be the choice. That's a really beautiful watch. Yeah. Stunning. |
| James Stacy | Yeah, and one other shout out, I finally got a chance to meet Lydia Winters from Lydia's Watches. She was doing some work with Nomos on these and it was super nice to see her at the fair and get a little bit of a backstory on working with Nomos for some of these and the photography and the stuff that went with them. It was super nice to connect with her. The watches are rad and yeah i don't know there's certain brands like i get excited when i get to be excited about a seiko i get it's really nice to be pumped about a new citizen it's really pumped fun to be pumped about a halios and no most for me is still in that vibe for sure yeah all right so yeah that's uh that's watches and wonders there's no way we got to everything um i went through the stuff that i saw i didn't really want to do a lot of commentary on other stuff you know, last year you were at the show as well, so we might have had a somewhat wider spread. I tried to cover the majority of the stuff I was interested in, but I know there's stuff I missed out on, simply because you can't be at every single meeting, right? Yeah. So there's definitely a lot more to see. I also had an incredible time hanging out with Kenneth from Arkin and Tom from Clements. This is our kind of second year of hanging out with them. We went and grabbed a drink at the Grand Duke. If you know Geneva, that's a place you can drink. It's not something... It's not my favorite place, but it is a nice place in the city. We met up at the Beaurevage, and it's just really nice to see those guys and hang out. Two of my favorites. And we'll see Kenneth at the Vancouver Timepiece Show, which I'm super pumped about. And yeah, it was all in all, especially that Friday when I got to do Doxa and Zen and Marathon and hang out with Kenneth and Tom. That's the day for me. It was really nice. It was sunny. Yeah, I was just missing you. Everything else was good. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah. Yeah. It looks like it was a good show. A lot of good watches and good people. Yeah. Great stuff. |
| James Stacy | By all means, if you have any specific questions, more things you want to talk about, if you're listening to this and you go, what about this watch? What about that watch? Put it in the Slack. Send us an email. We're a little bit behind on Q&As because of Watches and Wonders, but we'll catch up on that. So if you've got a question, you can always record it and drop it in for a future Q&A. But look, I mean, we're shooting up on an hour and a half here, so I think that's probably at least a good point to start as far as talking about all these new watches. Jason, anything else on your list that you saw from the show that, like, beyond the stuff that I had kind of entered in? |
| Jason Heaton | Um, no, I mean, I didn't, I didn't see much else. I mean, I was kind of doing most of my following on, on social media and then on, uh, on Hodinkee. And, and I think we, we covered the bases, we covered the TGN stuff. I think it's funny because, you know, we, we call it kind of a watches and wonders megazode, but I think the, the time to watch his stuff is almost even more appealing and the stuff that happens outside of Bell Expo. Yeah. |
| James Stacy | We're something like three weeks away from the Vancouver Timepiece Show, and there's a lot of brands there that are very much in our sort of core, sort of interest. So it's fun to be able to kick off sort of show season with a giant show and some stuff that, you know, is fun to talk about, but not really what I would call conventional or like real product. But it is nice that we had, you know, 10 plus watches to talk about that kind of fit into the scope. I think a successful year and certainly from some core brands. I think they they came swinging. They came came to make an impact. Yeah Good. Well, that's a proper megasode an hour and a half for sure. Yeah And we still got final notes. Why don't uh, why don't you kick it off for us? |
| Jason Heaton | Sure. Yeah, um, my buddy chris sent me this article It's actually a couple years old from 2023, but I hadn't seen it before and it's on a website called TWZ, which I think is The War Zone. As you can imagine, it's very military history based. And this story is pretty wild. It's pretty fascinating. It's titled Special Forces Parachuted with Nukes Strapped to Them During the Cold War. You know, it's, it's, it's just goes back to, I mean, I, it's, it's, it's weird to say that I'm nostalgic for the cold war, but I think there was just so much that happened during that era between, you know, the, the mid forties, you know, late forties up until the late nineties or early nineties rather that, that was just so bonkers. Um, you know, you think about operation Ivy bells, you know, these divers tapping underwater cables off the coast of the Soviet union and things like this, the developments of, weapons and aircraft and the spy stories and whatever and this this just fits right into that and the lead image is you know a guy in free fall the backpack and then he's straddling what I assume is you know some sort of a nuclear weapon and it's it's it's just crazy that that these guys were doing that and this story gives this this whole background um of this top secret program in which special forces paratroopers were jumping out of aircraft with what they called SATOMs or special atomic demolition munitions. strapped between their legs. These things weighed a couple hundred pounds. They would be parachuted into remote areas to set these things off and then with the hopes that they could escape in time to escape the fallout if they actually had to detonate them. It was just this top secret program that was Um, just wild. I mean, it kind of reminds me of a lot of the stuff we saw when we were at the man in the sea museum, you know, with the sea lab stuff and just, you know, getting a glimpse into the, the, the daring, incredibly dangerous missions that people were doing back, back then that, that I'm sure is still going on these days that somebody, you know, 30, 40 years from now will be, on some future podcast will say did you know that back in 2024 they did you know whatever but um anyway it's a good read it's interesting some of the photos are just crazy um and you know i know that a lot of our audience kind of digs this sort of thing so i thought i'd drop it in here |
| James Stacy | Yeah, I mean, dude, this lead image is like something out of a Mission Impossible film. This doesn't look like reality. This might be Tom Cruise and somebody just, you know, added a grainy element in Photoshop or something like that. This is nuts. Yeah, very cool story for sure. Yeah, good share for sure. Mine this week is actually a really easy one. I've been so underwater with just focusing on Watches and Wonders that I haven't really gotten you know, to read a book or dig into a lot else these days. But mine is an Instagram account I came across. I've realized in the last little while that I have, and I'm sure lots of other people do, hence this very popular Instagram account called Tech Nostalgism. And it's essentially just an account that gives you these AI-voiced little videos about technology from the pre-iPhone era, right? And I was such a complete nerd for this stuff when I was younger. I had mini discs. I loved every accessory for early iPods. I love this world where not everything had to be a phone. And I even remember back in the day having a BlackBerry and my iPod and being like, why on earth would I want my music on my phone? Right? Well, I'm clearly the problem here. But I really love some of this stuff. So it's handheld radios, it's Discmans and Walkmans. cool home stereos that you're, you know, you would have your, your Discman or your, your mini disc player. And when you get home, you could take the entire player and like click it into your stereo and the stereo would take over. And it's just like, this is a world that's so, feels so much more real than what we have, where we just have, we all just have these kind of similar looking rectangles. And don't get me wrong that the industrial design of an iPhone or a modern Samsung, like incredibly, specific and beautiful and careful and really impressive, but there was something much cooler going on before everything was just a screen that you held in your hand. When they had all of these aesthetic and sort of UI problems that they were constantly solving for. How could I make it smaller? You know, I watched one today that was like a two and a half minute long reel about the smallest voice recorder, like tape driven voice recorder that Sony ever made. And I was just enthralled. Like, I couldn't stop watching these. I got totally addicted and have watched most of what's on the account at this point. It's called tech nostalgism on Instagram. And, you know, if you're like me, I'm in my very late 30s and just grew up obsessed with weird little cameras, minidisc players, Sony Makovas, all this kind of stuff I found really, really special. And I loved that a lot of these devices had very specific worlds of accessories, whether it was the system that allowed you to record your own music onto a minidisc, and there was a a head unit and there were things for the car and there were special air pods or like earphones and that sort of thing and then you know they even cover stuff that is weirdly prescient of what's coming you know they had like a sony discman that had like a little remote that you could clip to your clothes so it could stay in your bag and you'd have play pause and the remote was also a, I believe, a wireless radio transmitter. And then it radioed what you were listening to to what was quote unquote a wireless headset, but it was pre-Bluetooth. So it was radio. So you can imagine the quality. You go through all this work to have incredible digital quality from a mini disc and then pump it over radio. But just the idea that that was all one unit that you bought and it came with all these little bits and pieces and now you get a phone and a USB cable. There's a certain romance to it, and I know that romance is based on me being born in the mid 80s and growing up in the 90s when Palm Pilots and Blackberries and stuff was everything. And yeah, I find all of it fascinating. I've had so much fun just spending 10 minutes at a time on this account. I have it, you know, saved. It's probably if I open Instagram, that's what it's going to go to at this point. But yeah, if you're if any of that sounds interesting, check out the account because I just I love this stuff. It's so much fun. Yeah, this is fun. |
| Jason Heaton | This is great. |
| James Stacy | Some of it I've never heard of before either, which is super fun. It is brand new to me. |
| Jason Heaton | Well, and I'm just, I'm struck by the effort that was taken to collect all this stuff and make all these individual reels. And I mean, this is, this is incredible. This, a lot of this stuff is probably quite rare and, and much less finding one that's actually still functional. I mean, this is really cool. |
| James Stacy | Dude, little Sony, Sony Clie UX50. It's like a little mini laptop that you're supposed to carry around. It did like almost nothing. I just like, I love this stuff. I think it's fascinating. The videos also, to be clear, I said they're like AI voice. The videos, the quality is lovely. They do a really nice job. My guess is it's just easier for them to type the script and have it read. And except for the pacing, you can't tell that it's AI to a certain extent. So I don't find it that weird. I know that the AI voice thing can bother some people. But the rest of the videos make a case that you're not watching something that's AI driven entirely. It's probably just easier for them, which I can which I can accept. But man, there's some some real cool stuff on this. |
| Jason Heaton | Yeah, this is a good good rabbit hole. I love it. I love that. You know, here we are on our iPhones in Instagram looking at looking at this videos of old tech. It's it's there's some weird meta thing going on there. But that's that's really cool. |
| James Stacy | yeah it's uh yeah i'm just i'm like i'm having trouble paying attention to the show while scrolling this there's so much good good videos here i want to watch and cool little screens old screens used to be so much cooler yeah uh than they than they are now i mean they're definitely better now but yeah not not as interesting perhaps so i highly recommend it was a it's a really fun little low lift rabbit hole to uh to just kind of get lost in some of these reels for a bit yeah But yeah, that's the episode. A whole bunch of new watches. Like I said, I'm sure we didn't hit all of them, so hit us up in the Slack if you want to have more of a broader conversation about any of this, or if you have any feedback or that sort of thing. And if you have any specific questions, you can always email them to thegreatnadoatgmail.com, or if you send in a voice memo from your phone asking the question, we can use it in a future Q&A, and that you can get access to for as little as $5 a month. I hope you enjoyed the episode. I'm looking at a counter of about an hour 40. So by the time we, you know, cut away my errors, we'll probably have at least an hour and five. It'll be a nice long episode. So thanks so much for listening. And if you'd like to subscribe to the show notes, get into the comments for each episode, or even consider supporting the show directly, which gets you into the Q&A, could get you a TGN signed NATO, etc. Please visit TheGreyNATO.com. And just as it was the first time we did an episode from the show in episode one, music throughout a siesta by Jazar via the Free Music Archive. |
| Jason Heaton | And we leave you with this quote from Jack Antonoff who said, the heart and soul of pop is newness, excitement, innovation. |